A Corvette Too Far…

xupeyvShow Your Projects threads have become a staple of many sim racing communities, allowing prominent third party talents within the ecosystem to display and discuss their upcoming releases in a very laid-back fashion, and with the Assetto Corsa modding scene migrating to the forums over at RaceDepartment.com from their original home inside the Kunos Simulazioni domian, conversations are now allowed to flow in any direction the users may desire. A user by the name of RC45 has recently decided to open up about his massive Chevrolet Corvette C5 project – which will see many variations of the American brand’s popular sports car head to Assetto Corsa – though not everyone is happy with what he has revealed to his fellow sim racers.

e3d8b6ad6aac974c9d0b645a3d70edd2Originally intended to be an open and diverse modding platform before Kunos Simulazioni inexplicably chased out the third party content community they had once helped nurture, RC45 has gone against the grain and taken the time to voice his frustrations with the modding side of Assetto Corsa – criticisms which many diehard fans once believed to be the product of irrational vendettas and hate campaigns. On the outset, sim racers are led to believe that creating content for Assetto Corsa is extremely simple, with the physics engine working hand in hand with basic variables outlined in various notepad documents to produce an accurate replication of the real car’s performance within the game. And in theory, the more real-world values are collected and used within said files, the more authentic the on-track experience within the game world. This is what has drawn so many sim racers to Assetto Corsa in the first place, away from the isiMotor environment they’ve spent several years studying; modding is simply that much easier in Assetto Corsa.

Unfortunately, RC45 is yet another modder who has instead grown frustrated with Assetto Corsa. After spending nearly one hundred hours on bringing the Corvette C5 to life inside his simulator of choice, the author has instead grown frustrated with the shortcomings of the software. Despite going above and beyond for a car he loves, learning the inner-workings of what makes a Corvette C5 a unique piece of automotive art, none of this information applied when he tried to put it into Assetto Corsa.

1RC45 dives into great detail about his Corvette C5 project inside the RaceDepartment thread – which I’ve linked in the opening paragraph of this article – but his findings are quite interesting and directly contradict the rhetoric spread by the weaponized fanboys of Kunos Simulazioni. Assetto Corsa was not marketed as the answer to Gran Turismo or Forza, but rather a niche racing simulator fueled by an extremely accurate physics engine, whose cars were carefully implemented into the game world using as much real data as possible – with the developers themselves sometimes bragging about just how many real values they used.

kunosRC45 basically comes out saying Kunos Simulazioni are full of shit. This guy has a Corvette C5 up on jack stands in his own personal garage, and is meticulously measuring every single part to ensure his virtual representation of the car in Assetto Corsa is as accurate as it can possibly be.

niyltoWhat RC45 has found is certain to cause problems within the Assetto Corsa community. None of the numbers he’s physically measured himself produce an accurate representation of the car within Assetto Corsa, and he is forced to greatly skew variables within the configuration files just to make the virtual car feel right. Kicking things up a notch, RC45 also calls out Kunos Simulazioni’s unwillingness to listen to the community on the official forum, explaining to sim racers that they’re well aware of the shortcomings of Assetto Corsa’s physics engine, but they are too stubborn to admit their product might have flaws or be inferior to the competition.

2After all of this work on the Corvette C5, RC45 claims Assetto Corsa is an illusion, but to his credit actually attempts to explain to some sim racers what in particular Kunos have gotten wrong with a game that has otherwise garnered immense praise from the community.

r1rThe icing on the cake of his visual documentation and lengthy explanations are the flock of Assetto Corsa fanboys who promptly show up to the thread and label RC45 an “attention seeker” for criticizing the game’s inability to accurately translate his own hands-on research into proper results, despite a very tangible amount of work and dedication invested in bringing the Corvette C5 to life.

shillsI’ve spent several articles on PRC.net exploring the pack of Assetto Corsa apologists who basically attack anyone who finds any sort of fault within the game, and this is by far the best example I’ve ever come across. RC45 literally has a Corvette C5 in pieces on his garage floor and is putting in more effort to make a car for Assetto Corsa than Kunos Simulazioni themselves, yet brainwashed losers looking for meaningless brownie points literally show up out of the blue to tell him he’s just looking for attention, instruct him to stop posting at RaceDepartment, and move on to a different game. These people above, as well as anyone else who exhibit this behavior, are nothing short of pathetic. RC45 is crawling all over a car in an effort to create the most accurate mod ever for Assetto Corsa, but because his work is currently being hindered by a game with obvious shortcomings that this guy is more than qualified to talk about, the weaponized fanboys instead tell him to leave.

Brilliant. If these are the kinds of folks who help test the game for Kunos Simulazioni, it’s no wonder why the PC version has suffered all sorts of botched patch releases, and the console version was a complete and utter mess.

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151 thoughts on “A Corvette Too Far…

    1. When you enter real data to rFactor 2, it works like real life, it’s not the case for Assetto Corsa, you always have to use workarounds and substitute models 🙂

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      1. The physics of Assetto Corsa are not of simulation value, when you compare it to the way a racing driver and racing team and even vehicle manufacturers can use rFactor and rFactor 2’s physics to develop their cars and their drivers in a way that provides accurate data which they can rely on to use at races.

        To give you an example. All our race team clients and even our series clients, they don’t only use rFactor for track familiarization. They also use it to test setup data before they go to an event, they use it to test potential new part data, by developing new brakes or new engine performances and testing it in the game before they actually commit to building it in real life. rF1 and rF2 provide far higher accuracy for those things than any other simulation on the market. When it comes to Assetto Corsa, their game is marketed for a set audience which covers the Semi-Arcade side. When I drive rF1 or rF2, I’m always in a serious state of mind, I can’t just go out on the track and run a few laps. It is too simulation based and I treat it as such. I work on my setups, I push to find every tenth I can throughout a lap. I analyze too much. When I play Assetto Corsa, I can easily go in, pick a car and track, chill back and drive When using my Xbox360 controller and not give a care. The physics seem very much like Forza Motorsport 5, a console game physics HOWEVER, Kunos has done a great job for the simcade fans, but cut down to the wire, rFactor 2’s physics engine is by far the most simulation based physics engine using real life aero and physical data that no other title has come close to.

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    2. Because it’s easy and fairly straight forward, though as many who have actually done modding in it will tell you, it takes a ton of fudging of numbers. Though AMS and isimotor2 are a completely different bag of worms, Niels himself raises the question if the engine even properly simulates suspension movement. Though just like AC fans say it gets “close enough” and it feels “real”. But sims are always about making due with limited processing power, the thing is AC has a engine that is nearly 7 years newer that cuts out multiple light sources for that extra processing power and they’re still fudging numbers like crazy.

      Really makes you think.

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        1. Same place you have to fudge them when making a mod for any sim (whether it’s GPL, n2003, any of the gMotors, AC, etc), the tire model. Which kinda sucks, considering that the tire properties are the primary thing that defines a car’s handling characteristics.

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    3. LIST OF GIRLS THAT WILL CHEAT ON YOU;
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      Shelly
      Sherry
      Shirley
      Shyanne
      Sidney
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      Silvia
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      Skye
      Skylar
      [MOD EDIT: Removed]
      Sofia
      Sonia
      Sonya
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      Stacey
      Staci
      Stacie
      Stacy
      Stefanie
      Stephanie
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      Valeria
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      Vanessa
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      Wendy
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      Xiomara

      Like

          1. There’s a genuine science behind why mentally ill women enter my orbit from time to time.

            These girls suffer from what are called identity issues. They are unsure of who they are as a person. To compensate, they seek out someone with a strong identity, and “mirror” them. Your favorite bands are now her favorite bands. Your values are now her values.

            I’m aware that I’m a bit of a unique personality. These women interpret this as an especially strong identity they can mirror and attach themselves to.

            Like

            1. Basically, that means you are an attention seeker who would prefer ELIZA-like entity for girlfriend. You strongly believe in your personal superiority, yet hardly anybody else gives a damn. And you found yourself a nice way out of the situation: to hook up with women that need therapy instead of your company, using them as an asset to boost your already overinflated ego. Way to go, Ogonoski.

              Like

              1. Here’s the kicker: At the time, you don’t realize they’re ill. Since they’re mirroring your personality, it just feels like you met a nice girl whom you get along with quite well.

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                1. Not sure if it’s just me, but I can see people with psychological deficiencies right away and start feeling uncomfortable in their presence right away too.

                  I prefer to have conversations with people who can generate their own opinion on matters rather than with those who will just agree with every single thing I say. It’s simply more interesting this way. Otherwise what’s the difference between talking to yourself and talking to people like that?
                  And when you come to a certain conclusion with a group of people who usually tend to have a lot of different opinions, it’s just worth much more. Compare it to “Lord Kunos” and his fanboys army. He can utter any nonsensical thing, and they’ll all follow up with a “yeah!” Do you really want that? It will quickly turn you into something like him. Not to mention that being the case would render all your Kunos hatred as nothing more than some petty envy.

                  Like

                    1. You only want yes men in your circlejerk. To agree with everything you write here and hoping they don’t call you out on the manufactured BS.

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                    2. What exactly was wrong with Princess Diana? Not to mention I hardly doubt she had no opinion of her own on things.

                      Like

                    3. “Personality disorders can’t be spotted in five minutes.”

                      I can attest to this personally. I dated a girl with some kind of borderline or paranoid personality disorder. Not sure which, her doctors keep changing their mind which it is. At first its so exciting to be with someone who’s so interested in you, everything you like, everything you think, who seems to match you perfectly and who has a boundless energy for you.

                      Then they go apeshit and dump you three times in a two day period because you said something very mild that would roll off most people’s backs because their capacity to process emotions is broken beyond your ability to comprehend. Then she apologizes, tells you she has some mental disorder that you don’t realize is as bad until you hit wikipedia after the next breakup cycle, and from then on she’s paranoid about you dumping her and interactions become increasingly tense.

                      I’d rather date a recovering addict than a personality disorder. The former has a much stronger prognosis for ending up with any sort of insight into their behavior.

                      Liked by 1 person

                    4. It appears P*Funk and I finally have something we agree upon. My experience mirrors his, and our comments section will be taken down completely if one of you prolapse profesionals are retarded enough to track her down and bait her into posting here.

                      Don’t fuck around with these girls.

                      Like

  1. It’s funny how those faggots at RD treat it as an official forum for the game, forming lynch mobs and closing threads if they get too critical, but still know better than going to Kunos’ website themselves.

    Like

    1. The physics of Assetto Corsa are not of simulation value, when you compare it to the way a racing driver and racing team and even vehicle manufacturers can use rFactor and rFactor 2’s physics to develop their cars and their drivers in a way that provides accurate data which they can rely on to use at races.

      To give you an example. All our race team clients and even our series clients, they don’t only use rFactor for track familiarization. They also use it to test setup data before they go to an event, they use it to test potential new part data, by developing new brakes or new engine performances and testing it in the game before they actually commit to building it in real life. rF1 and rF2 provide far higher accuracy for those things than any other simulation on the market. When it comes to Assetto Corsa, their game is marketed for a set audience which covers the Semi-Arcade side. When I drive rF1 or rF2, I’m always in a serious state of mind, I can’t just go out on the track and run a few laps. It is too simulation based and I treat it as such. I work on my setups, I push to find every tenth I can throughout a lap. I analyze too much. When I play Assetto Corsa, I can easily go in, pick a car and track, chill back and drive When using my Xbox360 controller and not give a care. The physics seem very much like Forza Motorsport 5, a console game physics HOWEVER, Kunos has done a great job for the simcade fans, but cut down to the wire, rFactor 2’s physics engine is by far the most simulation based physics engine using real life aero and physical data that no other title has come close to.

      Like

      1. Is it really a big deal? How many people are measuring their cars to the exact mm and trying to recreate it in a game?

        Assetto Corsa sucks but this isn’t the reason why.

        Like

        1. the miata mod did.
          miatas are ridiculously well documented. I can tell you exactly how far apart all the rear suspension points are with 2 minutes of Google.

          Like

        2. “Is it really a big deal?”

          Its at the very least noteworthy. The quality and accuracy of a model of reality is directly related to how accurate its output is relative to accurate inputs. Since all reality can be rendered mathematically a model should be able to take mathematical inputs of reality to produce a simulated output of reality.

          How much fudging you need to do to get the accurate outputs is a direct criticism of the quality of the model and why models of real life are constantly being improved. This applies to all sorts of science and not just consumer sims. Everything from climate models to earthquake prediction functions this way.

          Its not terminal to the utility of the physics model but its noteworthy at least when it comes to using it. It means you need to understand that you can’t just plug numbers into it and get a realistic result. This is critical for people making mods of cars that they do not own and do not drive personally.

          Its also why real drivers are constantly critical of how a physics engine performs representing their own vehicles and why you often see the physics gurus in development teams complaining that the drivers are wrong because their numbers are right.

          Like

      2. Little late to the party, but did you ever consider that perhaps RC45 has no fucking idea what he’s doing? Because there’s your answer to the “lack of simulation value”. Dude’s clueless.

        Like

  2. I’m so happy for Kunos that the game is becoming such a huge success for them, Stefano must be making top dollar from all these sales and DLC packs?

    Like

  3. “I guess you are reading a different thread then – what I see here is some decent feedback between a couple folks engaged in a current development lifecycle of what they are working on.”
    So i guess we stopped reading at the point the mod maker decided he wasn’t being attack simply because it didn’t fit PRC’s narrative of everyone hating on the Anti AC crowd?

    But hey, nope no bias here, why not “grab it by the Pussy” whilst your at it, I’m sure your a big enough star in the mind of some of the more puerile here to get away with it

    Like

  4. Seriously, why bother? Kunos showed the door to all the modders at their forum for a reason. They just don’t fucking need mods, is that hard to understand? Because modders kept exposing deficiencies of the “physics” engine, and churning out a DLC every now and then is more profitable than letting modders make these cars available for free.

    Taking a car apart to measure each part up so that it could be brought to Assetto Corsa? Sounds like one of the most ridiculous ideas I’ve heard of. If you are ready to go that far, at least pick a simulator worth of your efforts. I’m surprised it’s mostly the camber values that need to be changed to make the car behave in AC.

    AC fanboys kind of have a point though. The car behaves weirdly when you feed correct numbers to the engine? Do you really think Kunos would say “thank you so much!” and dart out to fix their crap? If you do, then I have a surprise for you… If you don’t, then what’s the point of accusing them of having a simcade-ish physics engine (at RD, no less!)?

    You know what’s the right way to do, don’t you? Hint: there are isiMotor titles around…

    Like

    1. The physics of Assetto Corsa are not of simulation value, when you compare it to the way a racing driver and racing team and even vehicle manufacturers can use rFactor and rFactor 2’s physics to develop their cars and their drivers in a way that provides accurate data which they can rely on to use at races.

      To give you an example. All our race team clients and even our series clients, they don’t only use rFactor for track familiarization. They also use it to test setup data before they go to an event, they use it to test potential new part data, by developing new brakes or new engine performances and testing it in the game before they actually commit to building it in real life. rF1 and rF2 provide far higher accuracy for those things than any other simulation on the market. When it comes to Assetto Corsa, their game is marketed for a set audience which covers the Semi-Arcade side. When I drive rF1 or rF2, I’m always in a serious state of mind, I can’t just go out on the track and run a few laps. It is too simulation based and I treat it as such. I work on my setups, I push to find every tenth I can throughout a lap. I analyze too much. When I play Assetto Corsa, I can easily go in, pick a car and track, chill back and drive When using my Xbox360 controller and not give a care. The physics seem very much like Forza Motorsport 5, a console game physics HOWEVER, Kunos has done a great job for the simcade fans, but cut down to the wire, rFactor 2’s physics engine is by far the most simulation based physics engine using real life aero and physical data that no other title has come close to.

      Like

  5. why these simulation value expert modders keep saying that rF2 and and amms are superior modding platforms but still continue to mod for ac lmfaooooo

    Like

    1. cause rF2 is too complex for your everyday modder … that is why new company that bought rF2 plans to add rF1 physics to rF2 for modders as option ..

      Like

  6. I don’t know why modders continue to support and shill for Assetto Corsa when Kunos kicked the entire modding community out of their forum. Kunos doesn’t care about the modding community and one of the reasons why the modding section got deleted was due to that modders were exposing the inaccuracies in AC’s simulation.

    Like

  7. With the real-life-values-transferred-into-the-game inaccuracies I can live.. but holy hell. Look at how Michael’s reaction came about. In a two-liner he ad-hominem’d him, insulted the modder’s skills, suggested that he is not worthy of AC’s community and should go to a fitting one (insulting the rF2 community as a whole in the process), and FURTHERMORE suggested that the majority of AC’s mods are rips. A guy who wasn’t exactly against modding before it got shut down out of the blue on the official boards.

    Man. The game isn’t even half as bad as, how you put it, weaponized fanboys. I remember another instance where a guy asked on the official forum why the Zonda gear ratios were “wrong”. Mr. Levesque answered short and concise “cause the tyres get bigger”, and that answer was taken as a personal offense by the guy who asked the question, and Willy got ignored by him in the process. WTF? The problem isn’t the AC community, it isn’t the simracing community, it’s sissies with a permit to be offended by ANYTHING. Fuck. /rant

    Liked by 1 person

      1. You’re going to tell me its likely the modder who has access to actual cars is wrong about the suspension measurements he has next to the ones Kunos placed in the text files for the game?

        Like

    1. HAHAHAHAHAHA, that was hilarious indeed.

      More recently there was this one thread asking what app made you faster. I simply responded “None, except maybe the delta to find a tenth or two in certain corners”. Which made a bunch of guys gang up on me for bragging.

      So sorry I don’t feel the need to have my screen covered in shitty apps m8. These guys man, they get offended for the dumbest reasons.

      Like

  8. Omg while it’s a worthy article is anyone really shocked that any game other than rf2 use real world data as a selling pitch only,there’s a reason rfpro is used to developers vehicle parts,and iracing is used by a lonely few to gets used to the tracks.
    Asseto ands iracing are just an interpritation by its model creators,just like David kammer thinks cars have 4 ovens containing tyres on each corner.

    Liked by 1 person

  9. Assetto Corsa community keeps growing by the day and is bigger than ever. Lord Kunos has made sim racing great again, this is a movement!

    Like

    1. “Lord Kunos has made sim racing great again, this is a movement!”

      Yeah I get the feeling thats what AC dweebs actually think, if it is a “movement” it would be comparable to 3rd wave feminism, cause we all know how AC fuckboys love to talk about “feelings”.

      Like

  10. You ever stop to think that maybe this modder doesn’t have a fucking clue as to what he is doing? Yeah I can put my car on my lift and measure everything too. I can even put it on my alignment machine if I really want to go crazy. But in the end I don’t have a clue as to how to put that data into an AC car model. You ever think that maybe he made some incorrect calculations and even if he entered the data into an ISI motor sim that it would act a similar way? I know of more than a few modders who have done just this taking measurements from their actual car and the AC version is very similar to the real thing. One guy IN THAT THREAD even made his actual track car and he said it was spot on.

    And again it is not the fact he may have uncovered issues but it’s the way he goes about it that brings up the problems with other members. If he had an actual case he should have made his own thread showing his data and what is “wrong” in an intelligent manner and nobody would have had an issue with it. But to go off and say “AC is a toy and not a true sim” is just baiting the other forum members. That thread is about what people are working on. Not for a back and forth arguing about ACs engine. Yeah it has issues, guess what genious, they all do. But the overwhelming majority would tend to point to the fact that this “modder” doesn’t have a fuckin clue as to what he is doing.

    Like

    1. I just tried to bring my 1989 Vauxhal Chavalier into Assetto Corsa.
      I created a new subfolder in AC cars folder, put all the pictures of my car in there, and guess what? It does not even show up in the game.
      What a joke!!

      Like

    2. So what you are saying is that only people who know exactly HOW to massage and fudge the numbers going into the ini and lut files know what they are doing. So you are pretty much agreeing with the poster over at RD then. Assetto Corsa is a cute game that uses cleverly fudged numbers.

      Like

      1. If in real life you don’t have exact architecture of every piece in a car or motorcycle, then things won’t work right. Therefore in game you need to mind every file/parameter so that it suits the car you want to make. This is valid for any sim. The only times fudged numbers are used is when you don’t have data from real life. And when you convert numbers/data/make calculations in a simulator, that isn’t fudging numbers.

        Like

        1. If you change the camber value in a tire file to achieve optimum grip then you have fudged the numbers. In real life you make a camber change on the actual car to change the behavior, you don’t take a syringe and inject “extra grip juice” into the tire.

          Like

          1. You make the car as it is in real life for the suspensions, engine, aero, etc. then you make tyres. You don’t make tyres to compensate for suspension physics. Otherwise you’re just doing it wrongly and you’re trying to patch up your bad work on the rest of the car by saying you need to fudge tyres to compensate for your bad work on suspensions, aero, or whatever.

            Like

          2. You’re assuming the Kunos values are totally correct to the real tires… Is that not a bit of an issue in and of itself? It’s not “grip juice”, it’s physics. There’s nothing unrealistic about altering the optimum camber of a tire (unless you know 100% that it’s the exact same as real life already).

            Like

  11. I think the guy had a neat idea for a mod project by measuring up his own car and whatnot. He’s clearly frustrated and disappointed that things didn’t work out the way he planned and that’s why he is lashing out. I rarely venture over to racedepartment because it really has become an echo chamber where no negativity or dissenting opinions are tolerated, but this just seems to me like a guy who got roped in by marketing hype. He got the real data, but without any understanding of how the engine interprets that data and makes physics calculations, well, of course the car won’t feel right. I think we would do well to remember that these are not professional simulation products and cannot achieve complete, objective accuracy. “Real data” is puffery, marketing speak, and you can’t take it to mean much more than that.

    Like

  12. When you enter real data to rFactor 2, it works like real life, it’s not the case for Assetto Corsa, you always have to use workarounds and substitute models 🙂

    Liked by 1 person

  13. Assetto Corsa is developed by Italian studio Kunos Simulazioni – Released two years ago for Windows, the game is now also on PS4 and Xbox, it does cede a little more ground to the notion that ‘game’ isn’t such a dirty word.

    According to James Dover, the game can be happily played with a controller. But while the game does deliver in terms of graphics, James reckons its physics engine “lacks seriousness”.

    Liked by 1 person

  14. assetto corsa is currrently the most accurate driving simulator on the market by far, most simulation value experts approve this statement!

    Like

  15. The physics of Assetto Corsa are not of simulation value, when you compare it to the way a racing driver and racing team and even vehicle manufacturers can use rFactor and rFactor 2’s physics to develop their cars and their drivers in a way that provides accurate data which they can rely on to use at races.

    To give you an example. All our race team clients and even our series clients, they don’t only use rFactor for track familiarization. They also use it to test setup data before they go to an event, they use it to test potential new part data, by developing new brakes or new engine performances and testing it in the game before they actually commit to building it in real life. rF1 and rF2 provide far higher accuracy for those things than any other simulation on the market. When it comes to Assetto Corsa, their game is marketed for a set audience which covers the Semi-Arcade side. When I drive rF1 or rF2, I’m always in a serious state of mind, I can’t just go out on the track and run a few laps. It is too simulation based and I treat it as such. I work on my setups, I push to find every tenth I can throughout a lap. I analyze too much. When I play Assetto Corsa, I can easily go in, pick a car and track, chill back and drive When using my Xbox360 controller and not give a care. The physics seem very much like Forza Motorsport 5, a console game physics HOWEVER, Kunos has done a great job for the simcade fans, but cut down to the wire, rFactor 2’s physics engine is by far the most simulation based physics engine using real life aero and physical data that no other title has come close to.

    Like

  16. It’s funny you see stuff like this (and the Porsche shitstorm they made) and still see some AC fanboys saying other sims fanbases are “the worst ever”.

    Like

  17. But this guy rc45 hasn’t yet said or even reported an issue about the AC software in respect to how he can’t put his data to simulate the car.
    He hasn’t asked any other physics modder for help.

    So James, are you telling me prominent physics modders like mclarenf1papa, david dominguez, kazdar qarim, and the physics guru eduard mallorqui have been doing illusion mods and their mods are all wrong? So we should believe rc45 or all the other modders who simulated a car using real data and measurements in Assetto Corsa? Please clarify.

    Rest of the physics modders and Kunos are mistaken and RC45 found that the simulation in AC is very very very very wrong? When those other modders find problems they post those issues for Kunos to fix (and so it happened, they posted and time later they fixed) and RC45 writes for prc without really exposing the physics issue for the developers to correct, if there’s anything to correct about what rc45 is saying?

    Like

    1. That’s why modders collectively received a boot from Kunos. Implying there can potentially be bugs in AC and especially in its physics is a sacrilege.

      Like

      1. Ok continue to make stuff up. Specially when the modding forum for discussing technical things about the mods and the game remains open. Only you’re not allowed to post new mods for skins, cars, tracks. Which is a different thing to discussing how to make a mod.

        Like

  18. In this article you posted a screenshot of RC45 quoting SportRotary where SR is saying that he accurately measured a car and that it behaves in game like in real life the car he drives, and then RC45 says he can’t build the car from the data.

    So why are you dismissing when a modder says he used real data to simulate his car and take another modders party when he says he doesn’t manage to do it using real data. This doesn’t seem objective coming from a simulation writer. On what basis are you agreeing with RC45 and disagreeing with SportRotary?

    Like

  19. James you didn’t read this thread? racedepartment com/threads/the-physics-discussion-thread.127125/

    David Dominguez, Stereo, and Mclarenf1papa are debunking the wrong methods RC45 uses to build the car in game. Make sure you read each post.

    Nice journalism bro, take the party of who suits your agenda (denigrate AC by all means necessary) and dismiss any investigation to see if your sources are correct. In this case RC45 is pretty incorrect. Once more another user submission gone wrong. -.-

    Like

      1. I think you are a nice guy James, there are some interesting writtings on here. But, your agenda against AC it’s becoming a tedious thing.

        Lets talk about AC’s “game value”, you have a very good point there if you want to bitch AC, but stop writing about reader’s submissions without further investigation because you will become a joke on every AC article.

        Like

      2. If they explained that rc45 is using the wrong methods to put his real data.. and in several parts he just copy pastes game files and expects everything to fall in place for his car instead of working on each file to make it represent his car.. please take off the blind cover of your eyes james.

        Liked by 1 person

      3. Did you even bother to read through the whole thread?
        This guy AC45 seemingly has no clue about what he is doing, but he’ll fur sure be thankful for you taking up his agenda.

        Like

          1. So did Mercedes, Porsche, BMW, Nissan, and the real DP manufacturers. If these kind of cars get enough air under the nose (e.g. when AC’s collision engine makes them pop off of the ground by a full foot…thanks Kunos), they will flip.

            Like

  20. Ok, lets go and do a C7 mod for rFactor with “real” data. I don’t care at all if a sim game is made with “plug & play” real data, or if the developer at the end arrived to the same final representation of a real car through other methods. If a model feels and reacts as close as possible as its real life counterpart, I don’t care which “data” is in the middle, be it real or “miss & try” data.

    It’s a simulation GAME after all. If you want real, go for the real thing and stop bitching.

    Have a nice day.

    Like

  21. Hello James, I think there should be an article on the biggest AC shill on the planet, Michael Hornbuckle. He is a convicted motorcycle thief, stole money from his friends, and forces his wife to work overtime to pay for his sim racing equipment. This man is a danger to society, and I am worried about the safety of motorcycle owners, as Hornbuckle could be on the prowl to steal someone else’s motorcycle. I feel sorry for his wife, who doesn’t deserve any of this, and she shouldn’t be working so hard for a scumbag piece of shit who is too lazy to work, and would rather sim race 24/7. Fuck Hornbuckle.

    Liked by 1 person

        1. That might be him. Might be not. Texas may have hundreds of people named that, honestly. Also, the Michael Hornbuckle we are talking about probably has a different real life name. To become a criminal one needs to have a certain amount of guts. The yapping guy on the forums he is doesn’t really make the impression of being able to do anything on his own, let alone be a criminal offender. As a stooge he could probably do something like stealing though.

          Like

  22. It is a game that simulates driving and costs $60.If it was an actual simulation it would probably cost $600 or would have about 10 cars.What the simulation value experts are demanding is the same as real race teams have.No problem,you just need to pay thousands for what they have.

    Like

  23. sucks we have to deal with ‘anal cavity’ guy that seems to be completely obsessive compulsive about this blog. Semi-ruins what could otherwise be interesting discussion.

    Like

  24. So, there is one guy “RC45” who says that the values of the real car do not translate correctly when put into the AC engine.
    Then there is another guy “rotarydrift” who says that it does indeed, and very well.

    One should at least consider the possibility that “RC45” might just be a complete stupid idiot, and now blaming AC for his own inabilities.
    They only things I can extract from that article are accusations from a modder without being anywhere even remotely scientific about anything.

    Like

    1. “Remotely scientific” as in “hammer it hard till it fits”?
      Personally, I don’t really care if it’s made of real life numbers or ones “processed” in some way if the end result feels and looks to be behaving appropriately. Except AC’s cars don’t.

      Like

  25. SIMULATION VALUE EXPERTS HAVE DEBUNKED ALL OF RC45’S RIDICULOUS FALSE CLAIMS, MOVEMENT HAS WON!!!! MAKE SIM RACING GREAT AGAIN!!!

    Like

  26. Quote out of the same thread:
    “My experience is a bit different. I have an FD RX-7 track car, and I’ve measured and made a kinematic model of all of the suspension points on my actual car. As a result, I found roll center heights, camber curves, KPI, scrub radius, mech trail, motion ratios, etc. Looking into the suspension.ini file, the Kunos kinematics model matches my kinematics model very well. I’ve edited the Kunos RX-7 model to have my (from my real track car) spring rates, ARB rates, ride height, alignment, damper data, torque curve, etc. I didn’t touch the kinematics data, I’m just using the Kunos data since it matches my model so well. The resulting car in AC handles and responds just like my car, and I can run almost identical lap times at VIR compared to real life. Now, the one thing I haven’t messed with is the tire data of the original Kunos car, but it seems to behave similarly to my tires (if they were creating any sort of “illusion,” I suppose it could be done here). So, in summary, real world data = Kunos data and real world feel = Kunos feel (in my experience).”

    Like

    1. If Assetto Corsa models camber by having the wheel pivot on a ball joint at the end of the axle and the in-game RX7 is spot on, either the data is flawed or the engine is flawed. Because in real life wheels are not on ball joints at the end of the axle – amiright?? 😉

      Like

      1. I don´t know what the fuck you are talking about, but i know very well that my lap times are matching the real ones awesomely close with many cars on many tracks in AC, just by driving as fast plus safe as possible. Try for yourself, if you have enough skills: http://fastestlaps.com/tracks

        Every professional software like the one i work with, is far from perfect, needs workarounds and have flaws. Only a stubborn dickhead call himself James is ignoring this fact and dreams of a perfect world where everything is for free without bugs.

        And every simulation like AC needs to simplify reality and go shortcuts, because a real car on a real track is just to complex to simulate and process in real time. But the telemetry should be accurate as possible and it´s certainly way above 90% in AC and lap times with my skills to often 99% to be by chance.

        Like

        1. Oh – so you don’t actually know how AC simulates a wheel then. It uses the a-arm pickups as input but simulates the wheel As if it is on a ball joint at the end of the axle to include camber.

          You didn’t know this?

          Like

  27. i love how rc45 is playing victim card after simulation value experts totally debunked all of his totally ridiculous false claims

    Like

    1. Nothing has been debunked – they have actually confirmed what was posted. Real feeling cars require massaged data, especially in the tire files.

      Like

      1. Not at all. RC45 just doesn’t know how to make a car in AC and apply his real data to the game software.
        Or are you gonna tell me that because Neils can’t work well with rf2 and had to resort to rf1 style is proof that rf2 is suddenly bad? The same way rc45 can’t work with AC (at least yet), but plenty of other physics modders can and have demonstrated their work with released mods.

        Like

      2. Instead of rc45 making a car from scratch up, he’s just borrowing models from others, getting files from the game, etc. etc. He’s doing plenty of shortcuts instead of creating from scratch up the car based on his real data. So of course in all that mix something’s gonna go bad.

        Like

        1. Buying models, using existing tire files for same sized heels, building chassis data from scratch. Seems like an appropriate use of available resources that any competent project manager would support.
          So what exactly is the problem here?

          Like

      3. All that’s been confirmed is that he has no real data for the tires, so he assumed he could copy paste from the 20 year newer C7 and get something close to what a C5 came with in 1997. And for some reason this led him to blame the chassis simulation, cause he used all real suspension data…

        Like

        1. Not true What has been established is that the physics engine is unable to manage using tires taken from one car and used on another car without tweaking the tire – even if the tire being used is the every same tire down to the size.
          So again, what is the problem here?

          Like

  28. Take from RD. Part of a Lord Kunos’ post:
    “So to say “like always” is simply a blatant lie… ”
    When did you last time see a mod editing the dev’s post on a pro-dev forum? 🙂 Is Stefano a pre-teen or something?

    Like

  29. sorry but if you can put in some numbers and the car behaves like the real one. Why the fuck should i care if this doesnt apply with every car because the engine has flaws. If you can get that thing close to real life who the fuck cares… task accomplished. Others go out drive, have fun while you better stick to drama as you are really good at it

    Like

  30. RFACTOR survivors
    SteamSpy

    22,037 ± 3,719 owners
    20,392 ± 3,578 players total92.54%
    6,578 ± 2,032 players in last 2 weeks29.85%

    Playtime in last 2 weeks: 7.9h (average) 3.3h (median)

    Playtime total: 48.7h (average) 13.6h (median)

    Like

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