Reader Submission #26 – Assetto Corsa AI, Aspiring Mensa Members?

Today’s Reader Submission comes from David G., who after reading yesterdays post about the Version 1.2 Update for Assetto Corsa, wanted to chime in with his own lengthy thoughts on the subject.


URD-T5-ASSETTO-CORSAI’m not sure how the AI in linked videos are set up as I just clicked through the videos because one dumb AI is the same as thirty dumb AI, but I have noticed a pattern while playing Assetto Corsa myself; setting the difficulty makes a huge difference to how well they drive. On the lowest setting, they are retards – braking randomly, taking stupid lines, and all kinds of weird shit seemingly because they are trying to drive to a certain lap time if that makes sense. Setting them at the highest setting, most of the field do well but some fuck up as if it’s too fast for that AI driver’s “skill level”. Driving between 90% to 95% AI difficulty is where I do most of my races and rarely do they make any mistakes. Maybe over ten laps someone will go off track or lock up coming into a corner, but other than that, they take a smart racing line, and drive aggressively but not in such a way as they are completely unaware that you’re there.

Granted, I’ve got no data to back up my wild claims of “it just works for me”, but I have run hundreds of laps in various cars and it seems to work perfectly for me playing with the AI between those two values.

Might be something for the Assetto Corsa devs to look into for the reasons why the AI are having issues.

Also, as a side note, I enjoy the site, guys. I have based what I buy and play to a degree from your articles, and your words do seem to match my experiences. Gave iRacing a go and ran into the 20 lap tire issues in the oval series. I started dicking around in 4Chan’s hosted stuff at about the same time they had a cry over James for what seems to be fuck all reasoning. Entered some of their series but timezones make anything but posting qualifying times nearly pointless.

But keep it all up, who gives a fuck if fanboys get mad over you all not bending over and licking the taint of every game that comes along. I don’t understand the point of getting mad over someone pointing out things wrong with the game you play.

Keep pissing people off, keep posting the articles you post, keep the podcasts up, but for fuck’s sake buy some better mics.


Screenshot_mclaren_mp412c_gt3_spa_18-11-2014-12-48-20I really like how you’ve addressed the recent AI issues that have come to light over the past few days with the release of Version 1.2. Indeed, like yourself, there are several hundred people playing Assetto Corsa right now with zero problems. However, now that there is properly documented evidence of huge AI shortcomings with the latest build of the game, it’s important to take these reports seriously, regardless of who posted them or how few and far between they are. I’m happy you’re enjoying the game, and I’m happy that you’re aware a few individuals are having problems without slamming them outright.

I run at 100% AI because I have setups built for most of the cars I prefer driving. When everything is going good, myself and the AI are pretty much even, and it can be pretty enjoyable to race against them. But my experience with the AI’s overall competence is about 50/50. Yesterday the racing at Zandvoort against the AI was atrocious. If the cars went side by side, the car on the outside would slowly wander outside of the track limits before coming to a slow stop. Today, it hasn’t been so bad at the same location. I’ve expanded my testing to Spa, and indeed noticed that the AI has no idea how to take Eau Rouge – the AI in the Lotus 98T slowed up to less than 120km/h to take a corner that’s usually almost flat out, and in a slower car, the Lotus 49, the exact same thing happened. Now I know some people will jump out and say “well, they were just cautious due to cold tires.” There’s a difference between lifting a bit extra due to cold tires and doing what the AI was doing, which was dropping two whole gears and pussy footing up the hill like they were in Renault Clio’s.

Your theory about running less than 100% AI strength makes sense if Aggression, Speed, and Competence are all mashed into one value. That’s something one of the Kunos boys (or beta testers) will have knowledge of, so in this case your friend would be the official forums. I know with rFactor, especially rFactor 2, you had to play with the aggression slider on oval tracks so the AI wouldn’t be afraid to run side by side with you, so again, if all three values are baked into one overall AI Difficulty slider in the main menu, it would make sense to lower it a bit.

I think, now that the issue has been brought to light, the community as a whole has to be very careful when addressing complaints about the AI. The guy who kicked off this whole madness was a known troll with a shady post history where the guy does nothing but sit on his ass writing mammoth paragraphs about how shitty Assetto Corsa is compared to other racing sims, but you can’t exactly deny video evidence. Already I’ve seen this in the official forums where people are bending over backwards to try and discredit him, and I’m definitely concerned as to how this will all develop over time:

lotusThe OP of the AI issues thread posts a video of the bots in Assetto Corsa spazzing out at Spa in the Lotus 98T, and someone tries to discredit him by saying the AI issues are related to the car/track combination, and that the Lotus 98T, a car that ships with the vanilla game, is a third party add-on. This gets better. When the OP refuses suggestions to turn down the car count, opting for a realistic sized 1980’s F1 field that is easily doable at Spa both in real life and in most other racing sims, he is essentially called a whiner by another forum member.

The sub-genre of hardcore racing games began in 1998, with the release of Grand Prix Legends for the PC and Gran Turismo for the Sony PlayStation. No NASCAR game since 2000’s NASCAR 2001 by EA Sports has ever shipped without a full 43 car field, and EA Sports in particular has often talked about the challenges of computing 42 AI drivers on-track, each with their own separate personalities. For fifteen years and two console generations, we’ve been able to load the grid with a reasonable amount of cars without any issues, and now suddenly in 2015, that’s too much to ask and you should turn the car count down so the game doesn’t break and you’re just a whiner if you think otherwise.

So please, when stuff like this comes up, resist the temptation to shit on a known troll and get to work on giving feedback, positive or negative. Ideally, do something like David G. wrote and list your own personal experiences, because if enough people attack someone with a genuine problem, it’ll get swept under the rug, and might pop up later in front of a much larger user base.

previewAs for the site, we do what we can. It helps being known shitheads to start with, so there is no reputation to uphold. Driving games have objectively gotten worse over the years, and we’re just calling it as we see it. Hopefully someone understands why we do what we do with this shitty little blog, and the next batch of driving games on store shelves are titles we can get lost in.

Advertisements

63 thoughts on “Reader Submission #26 – Assetto Corsa AI, Aspiring Mensa Members?

  1. It is weird how often people seem to forget that an argument stands solely on it’s merits.
    If the argument is solid and the evidence is there, it doesn’t matter who it comes from.

    Like

    1. yeah, except that…i mean, i like hex’s passion for rf2, but i really do believe he’d like to see AC wiped from the earth for what he believes to be its sake…which is just really, really, really weird. i dont doubt the AI has issues but i dont trust the video or much the guy says, simply bc if its reproducible he’s actively helping to make the game better. and i genuinely dont think he wants to do that. (ofc, afaik he only posted it to the kunos forum bc someone called him out on it)

      Like

      1. It doesn’t really matter though. The more exposure this sort of thing gets the more likely it is one of the devs will see it and focus resources towards fixing it, no matter what the intention of the person who made the video.

        Like

    2. Partly, but

      (A) So-called “video evidence” is not some kind of incontrovertible thing as PRC’s author rather ridiculously suggests. It’s perfectly possible to create a video that makes a game look bad. Especially a game that is open to modding. So if the poster of that video is an well known troll, of course you have to question the validity of it.

      (B) The AI did have significant improvements in 1.2. This is trivially demonstrable if you’ve played both 1.1 and 1.2.

      (C) As Stefano says, work with the software, not against it. So, let’s say the AI is rubbish with a full field (one suggestion is that possibly because the poster’s computer cannot handle the CPU load. If the suggestion is made to reduce the cars and the reporter has no interest then there’s no point wasting time on their report. Bug reporting is as much about finding the scope of the issue. It’s ridiculous to suggest that this is saying the game shouldn’t work with a full field – it’s just saying – try it, and if it does, well then the bug is limited in scope.

      So, report the bug and try fewer cars. However, don’t try and delude the world that the AI is worse than it is by choosing one extreme example.

      They are obviously actively updating and improving the game, including the AI, so it will get better. He isn’t saying an Ian Bell like “Tough” it’s more like “If you work with the game then you’ll have a better experience than if you work against it”

      However what is relevant is when the person who posts the video clearly has no interest in playing the game. There’s no point a community or game developer wasting their time on that person’s issues.

      Bottom line : These videos of the AI shown here, even if they are genuine, do not really reflect the reality of the AI in Assetto corsa in 1.2.x

      At best they are like showing Lewis Hamilton’s last F1 race before the holidays as evidence that he can’t drive or, conversely, finding a video from Pastor Maldonado where he doesn’t crash and claiming this is evidence that he can drive. You could say “This video is honest” but, it still wouldn’t be a complete and comprehensive picture. It’s still disingenuous.

      Liked by 2 people

  2. “and now suddenly in 2015, that’s too much to ask and you should turn the car count down so the game doesn’t break and you’re just a whiner if you think otherwise.”

    I seem to remember that when people were struggling with Project CARS at Monaco that this “you’re playing it wrong, use less cars” argument came up and people screamed blue murder about how a game should work no matter what settings you throw at it.

    How is the Lotus/Spa issue in this post any different?

    I’m a console gamer and haven’t played either game (PRC helped cement my decision not to buy Project CARS) but looking at this the car count shouldn’t be used as an arguing point in this case.

    The aggression being linked to overall difficulty makes sense however. James, have you tried AC on 95% after this user submission to see if it made any difference?

    Hoped full AC gets its AI and other issues (if there are any) sorted before the console releases, eager to play the game.

    Like

    1. I think the lower the number of cars was someone tying to explain that the AI use the same Physics calculations as the player, and as such he may have too many cars for his system and if he could try it out

      Like

  3. Didn’t imagine my slightly booze fueled email would have been made into a reader submission (thanks for fixing it up), It would be interesting to find out how the AI’s ‘thoughts’ are processed together and handled overall. After some more dicking around in AC after the email, at least for me they (AI) seem to have a harder time driver faster cars when at the 100% threshold than say letting them run around in a Abarth 500 or E30 BMW where even @ 100% there is rarely a fuck up with a full field of cars.

    But put them all in Ferrari 599XX’s and set at 100% and its not an outright mess but there are a lot more ‘offs’ than there should be, and then set them at 80% and the weird lines and way early braking comes into effect like they are trying to only drive to a certain lap time.

    Now I obviously like the game but in no way feel some deep seeded need to white knight it and defend its honor on some off chance that Kunos will hire me as Chief Salad Tosser. But finding faults and letting them know is the only real way to get something sorted.

    Like

  4. I wonder why Kunos is so stubborn and won’t hire more people instead of spending money on licences and expansions to consoles.

    What they made is very good, and with that come the same expectations that we have with the big boys. Content wise they have been able to scale up a little by buying models and sounds from the community, however I feel like more programmers wouldn’t hurt. Just having another set of eyes to look over your code improves the quality of your product immensely.

    My guess is that announcing new licences and features creates more hype and revenue than improving the existing stuff (not that they haven’t been doing that), but I feel like they will get roasted if they release the game on consoles should they continue along this path.

    On another note, it seems like the AI issues only play up with the faster cars/ racing cars. AC is very good at simulating road cars, and is quite unique at that. Such a waste that the community is not interested in this part of the sim.

    Like

    1. Like anything creative, simply throwing more manpower at a problem rarely gets the job done any better than before. It’s far more likely just to spoil things and end up with a hacked together mess. It would also drag the current programming talent away into supervisor roles, as all those new guys will need to be managed, so less of the actual hands-on development gets done by the truly skilled members of the team.

      If they have a tight, focused, effective dev team, then they can achieve amazing things. If they come across the *right* person to hire, with experience in the right areas, and the ability to fit into the team autonomously, then I’m sure they will hire them.

      “Moar programmers!” absolutely can hurt. I’d much sooner see them stay focused and effective. The fact alone that such a small team has created something so good is an indicator that it’s just the kind of team that would fall apart if they started flinging human resources at things. They’re at the top of their game, and working through sheer passion for what they do… if you spread that too thin, you kill the magic and turn it into a factory.

      Like

    2. They did mention in the 1.2 announcement that they’ve hired more staff, but that doesn’t mean the new employees will immediately be making positive changes (takes time to get acquainted with AC processes). And like you say, it’s not as interesting as license/dlc announcements so they’re just not saying a lot about it.

      Like

      1. I don’t see that as a ‘solution’.

        I just don’t think there are many people available to make meaningful contributions to the AC core, full stop. Even if money is no object.

        It’s just a matter of time and iteration, as I’m sure you understand.

        I’m really replying to the guy who said ‘just hire more people’, I suppose.

        Like

    3. We don’t need more shitty underpowered FWD street cars. We need a properly functioning racing sim. Either there aren’t enough programmers at Kunos or the ones they have just aren’t talented enough. Either way, it’s become an embarrassment to sim racing. Shitty off-beat physics, mind numbingly boring force feedback, atrocious AI… nuf said. Thank god it isn’t the only sim on the market.

      Like

  5. In Pcars they don’t have lack of people in the dev team, and the AI is at the level of some current and older sims. The fix of AI isn’t that simple, simply more because SMS already have several games with AI drivers and people still complain a lot about Pcars AI.

    Not taking a turn on pcars, but just writing an example based on the logic from your post.

    Like

  6. I have spent the last two days trying to recreate what the OP says randomly happened to him in his first 30 minutes of playing.

    The AI hate the 98t and exos 125 for sure, not sure why but this has been the case since day 1 and has probably kept Stefano awake for more than a few nights. So far the only way I have been able to reproduce the craziness of the OP vids is to either make a special event where every driver has a different difficulty level and the set the track to something ridiculous as far as temps and grip goes
    or tweak on the AI ini files. These are the only two ways to get the over the top results that the OP (and the author of this blog) seem to think are commonplace in 1.2

    So either the OP, which is widely regarded at the most anti-AC troll in the sim racing community, has the unfortunate luck to experience the AI’s absolute worst case behavior in his first few minutes of playing or he manipulated the code in order to make the video that he wanted to present.

    Anyways, this is the second time that this site has decided to shine a spotlight on one of the worst examples of the community possible so this is where I cut all ties that I had to this blog. Good luck to you Austin, but it is probably time for you to find a new team speak to hang out on.

    Like

    1. That’s funny cause in the first five minutes of loading up a random 100% AI race with the Miura I got the exact same thing, You were friends with Austin for quite a while and had no problems with him shitting on other games but he brings up one issue about AC that is in fact an issue and you are going to take your ball and run home. It’s not like the game is ruined, it is the most fun its ever been.especially in brawl rooms. Mike you have become the most biased person of any game I have seen at any point and that’s coming from someone who used to play fucking xbox during the console wars. The facts are that AC is way too easy to drive over the limit in comparison to real life and still be quick much like forza, but you will say its the best sim of all time cause it’s the only one you can be somewhat competitive in. I’m sure being a beta tester has no inherit bias at all either huh? You publically are saying you are cutting ties with someone because they posted one little issue in an otherwise fun and very much playable game yet you are going to throw a fit like a 12 yr old.

      Like

      1. Well, the Miura is one wild vehicle, so I definitely expect it to be a AI problem car. Doesn’t discount what you said.

        “The facts are that AC is way too easy to drive over the limit in comparison to real life and still be quick much like forza”

        Do you mean that loss of stability is not properly reflected in lost pace? Dependent on the type of vehicle, but I have occasionally been in situations (slicks, warm tires) that seemed like stability loss wasn’t as much of a problem as it should be. Usually in those situations you lose serious pace and maintaining stability is critical to competitive times, or at least that’s how it appears to me/have had actual racing explained.

        What you’re saying is that the line of lost pace is straying too far into the unstable territory?

        In the case of the Miura and other road cars, I don’t think it applies or at least to a lesser degree. Otherwise, I think it could use a bit of a tweak under certain circumstances.

        Like

      2. “Do you mean that loss of stability is not properly reflected in lost pace?” Exactly this you can take any gt3 car in the game completely overdrive the entry to the point the car wont turn in miss the apex jump on the throttle sideways out of the entire corner, and gain 3 tenths (this is without assists) with assists the car is kept stable through the coding of the game, and you just drive like a complete maniac and if you are able to trick the car into being sideways while full throttle with TC on you will start setting world record laps. iRacing is the complete opposite where you get anywhere near 1 degree of slip angle and you just die. In the case of the Miura that car on 60s style tires should drive like a giant boat that wants to be in a perfect 4 wheel drift off the corner where the rear tires are gripping and you just hold the wheel straight while controlling with throttle. Yet even in the Miura you can completely overdrive the car to the point of missing the apex by a mile and well past what optimal slip should be and still be within a tenth of your PB

        Like

      3. Ok, I understand what you’re talking about, and I think it’s an aspect that could use adjustment.

        I was having a good bit of fun in the Miura on nordschleife, seemingly thrashing cars with better tires and suspension, simply by taking the wildest lines that allowed me to get on the power more quickly.

        All about presentation. This is something Kunos can address (and will result in better MP and SP racing, imo) when explained the way you can.

        I think this is what James is trying to say in general with his choice of topics. Presenting polar opposite views doesn’t really help to fix anything. Nothing (or hardly anything) is either perfect or terrible.

        AC is great/vs. AC is terrible, both are pretty unhelpful opinions. I’m sure Stefano would agree.

        Like

      4. All AC needs is better multiplayer, and the way the car drives over the limit is fine. The problem is that is faster doing so. Pointing out a video of a multipayer bug is not a major issue for the games playability since most of it is online or hotlapping anyway, AC AI has never been a strong suit to begin with so I don’t understand why some people seem so shocked

        Like

      5. Oh one other thing: I normally don’t use TC, which may particularly exacerbate the problem. Either way, this is an aspect that I hope to see addressed.

        Like

      6. The reason I said better MP and SP is because if people and AI have more incentive to maintain
        stability, it directly leads to more controlled racing.

        But yes, the drive is fine I think too, even if it’s off a bit on pace in terms of stability. There’s a fine line, AC is closer to the reality of a fast laptime without fear than most I think, just maybe a touch too aggressive.

        I have been surprised at how real laps that appear too aggressive can actually be damned quick, so it’s hard to nail down. Real drivers usually have a sense of self preservation holding them back slightly and when they really let that go, their fastest laps often feature some incredibly controlled instability (predicted).

        I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s an aspect that is naturally addressed at some point through updates. Doesn’t hurt to calmly and clearly point it out, though.

        Like

    1. There is nothing about saying that there are a million different reasons ai is acting weird ( something that is being worked on as we speak) that makes you a shill. There is. I verification of the specs they are running etc in the videos.

      There is nothing right about glorifying hex or ass-ocistor who is the worst of the worst shit posters on the Internet for rf2 and he does the same stuff for star citizen and elite dangerous as well. Not once but twice.

      It seems that we are never going to agree on this and it has killed any credibility we had and had destroyed a lot of potential relationships with devs and others.

      I’m not going to be a part of being deliberately inflammatory and essentially trying to create controversy rather than report. I guess I’ll get labeled a shill or troll but I’m out.

      Like

      1. This isn’t worth continuing but I have said plenty of times what AC lacks and what I wish it had with out glorifying someone who has problems.

        Last post goodbye.

        Like

      2. I don’t think you should view it as a hit to credibility necessarily. I also don’t think honest developers can take much issue with the article. I still saw it as AC positive overall.

        Anyways, would be sad to see you go. You’ve given me a new appreciation of what oval racing is actually about. Also, I just don’t see the podcasts working without your involvement.

        I like that you guys can have contrasting opinions and are willing to say so.

        You guys have the ‘oh he’s a ___ fanboy’ pre-conceived opinions being thrown around, I see this is an attempt at providing ‘balance’, even if it’s functionally useless to Kunos when presented the way it has been in the videos.

        That’s the only ‘problem’ imo. The videos are clearly for trolling and not for fixing problems.

        Like

      3. “I’m not going to be a part of being deliberately inflammatory and essentially trying to create controversy rather than report.”
        How did you just realize you were doing this now

        Like

  7. You had no problem doing this against other sim/games “It seems that we are never going to agree on this and it has killed any credibility we had and had destroyed a lot of potential relationships with devs and others.” but as soon as it hit a game you enjoy you try to deflect and protect it. Pretty sure that is the definition of shilling, as much as you complan about iRacing fanboys Chris, you are doing exactly what they do.

    Like

    1. Actually, iirc he’s less of an AC fan than James is.

      I think he really doesn’t like the people behind the linked videos… For some valid reasons, mind you.

      I personally do not condone supporting their behavior, as a whole. It doesn’t matter what the game is.

      I think that’s his point.

      Like

      1. Then why aren’t they listing there side of it instead of straight up lying that the video is using a mod or hacked files to prduce the results when I can go in a 98t at spa right now and wont make a pace lap. I have more then enough forum posts from iRacing of Chris and Mike spamming iRacing forum with how much better AC (essentially doing what the guy they “hate” is doing in their opinion” is and how bad iRacing is yet they are on iracing every day doing races. and instead of arguing their side they just say ARE YOU 5? or “This isn’t worth continuing”

        Liked by 1 person

      2. His side is that he doesn’t like the two uploaders and doesn’t condone providing traffic to them specifically.

        Idk who Mike is and iracing has been and still is pretty bad in multiple fundamental aspects.

        Sounds like iracing troll videos from seemingly professional multi game full-time trolls would be equally unwelcome to Chris.

        It’s the content providers and their malicious intent more than the content.

        Like

      3. Also, I don’t think anyone is denying (at least I’m not) that you can induce AI issues and might well stumble into problems, even if you aren’t looking for them intentionally.

        It’s not entirely fucked and there are workarounds.

        Like

  8. I don’t agree with intentionally failing to report on huge issues with Assetto Corsa’s AI just because the guy who made the compilation video isn’t liked on Reddit. This is no different than iRacing fanboys dismissing our 2,500 word iRacing Street Stock review because “lol Austin is a known iR hater with a crazy agenda.” As someone above mentioned, ooRickyBobby is notorious for being Associat0r-like on the iRacing forums, with nearly every post slamming iRacing, and his own signature reading “Assetto Corsa can’t come soon enough.” Why are we dismissing some Reddit aspie’s posts based on reputation alone when one of our own (or I guess, formerly) is doing the same thing for a different game?

    It’s wrong to treat someone else in a manner that we ourselves do not enjoy being treated, especially when I’ve been able to replicate the exact same AI problems Associat0r has drawn attention to just by booting up a race under normal, realistic settings. His complaints are valid and it’s something that needed the attention drawn to it – for a game that aspires to be better than pCars, it sure has a lot of the same bugs, even down to not being able to select your car’s color.

    If refusing to sweep one game’s issues under the rug in an effort to keep a certain beta tester from raging on Teamspeak means I have to fly solo for a while, so be it. The integrity of the site has obviously not suffered due to the influx of people showing up here (3,000 daily) and E-Mailing my ass at 3AM local time raving about the site and begging for me to post their Reader Submissions.

    Like

    1. Just keep in my mind, by linking to those videos specifically, you are potentially providing attention and revenue to these guys

      Drop the link to the specific video and then you’re still achieving the same thing, you simply aren’t supporting those particular people directly.

      Needn’t be a case of ignoring at all. I simply know that some people go out of their way to misrepresent specific titles, and their views are unreliable to say the least. Some apparently get paid for this shit.

      Would rather see anyone else’s take (even if it’s even more ridiculous) linked than someone from the ‘known shill’ list. Non-shills do not support shills.

      Would rather not see pcars stuff from them, either.

      Like

      1. I guess by that logic someone should start up notPRC.net and re-write all our iRacing articles so there’s “someone else’s take” by a writer who isn’t somebody who got IP banned from the sim. I highly doubt this kid is making ad revenue off his tiny ass YouTube account; just like those who claimed PRC.net generated ad revenue for each hit to the site. Ok then, go find the AdSense ads on here. I’m waiting.

        The kid’s a huge autist on Reddit but he was the first to extensively document the current AI issues. At that point it doesn’t matter who he is or how many people hate him because the footage doesn’t lie and can be replicated by anyone with 30 seconds of spare time. Before I’d even seen his videos I’d experienced AI retardation at Zandvoort, and by the sounds of it, other people have as well.

        But yeah, he’s hacking the game. Ok then.

        Sure, I could have made my own twelve minute video of the AI bugging out, but the end result is the same – would have gotten yelled at on Teamspeak and told to go find somewhere else to chill out for daring to say something bad about AC because I guess that’s off-limits when one of the beta testers throws tantrums if you speak out against Lord Kunos.

        PRC.net had the same reputation as Associat0r when this site was first created, and only grew in size because article after article hit the nail on the head and claims were properly sourced. Shitty post history aside, those issues exist in 1.2.1, and doing everything under the sun to discredit him is WMD investor tier. Regular visitors of this site should know better than to just slam a guy and instead actually pay attention to what’s been presented to you because that’s literally why people come here.

        Like

      2. You’re kind of going to polar opposites.

        The iracing articles are already an attempt at providing balance.

        Also, simply because you haven’t put any real effort into monetizing your traffic doesn’t mean that others aren’t. Maybe the ones we are talking about simply enjoy the attention and/or want more people to play the games they like. Not sure and doesn’t matter.

        “but the end result is the same – would have gotten yelled at on Teamspeak and told to go find somewhere else to chill out for daring to say something bad about AC ”

        Well, I do see overreaction and they do seem more motivated by the subject than the videos themselves, so I can’t disagree. Beta testers are generally pretty defensive due to developer relations.

        At the base of it, I come here because I believe what you say. I don’t need video evidence. You can link any supporting evidence you wish. Content from associator types is functionally useless in my opinion and I would rather see it left off in favor of your words alone.

        I suppose it is about credibility. Your opinion has credibility (part of why the site works), associator’s does not.

        Just keep it in mind. I’m not hugely concerned either way. People will poke holes in known weak/biased sources before they even check for themselves, and that’s kind of what happened here.

        You’re an evil mastermind because you understand that controversy is one thing that can really drive a website.

        Like

  9. So the fact that the video creator has a history of miss-informing people like using examples of things that apparently happened in a build of a game that hadn’t been released for a year after he said it had couldn’t possibly be the reason so many took it to discredit him? at the end of the day no-one ignored the fact that things had issues, but when someone tells you for month upon months that so and so game is “better” simply because it has features that other games doesn’t you tend to take it as another blatant attempt to upset the community and cause arguments. You have even said yourself he has a massive history but expect people to just ignore that and take his word as gospel. not at all like Ian Bell eh? easy to throw latent insults at a crowd of people who are dissatisfied with something you have produced init?

    Like

  10. James, you didn’t research about Ass’s list of “AC flaws” https://pretendracecars.net/2015/07/07/like-it-or-not-associat0rs-comments-about-assetto-corsa-are-pretty-accurate/
    You just took them for granted, as well as his “sources”, you took them for granted. Those sources are just opinions of other people and doubts/questions how the game works and if is correct or not. Some of those things like underbody collision was a user mistake where he thought car hit the kerb with bottom or with the spoiler, but in the replay file that user posted you can zoom in and see it bounced after hitting the tire.
    He links “poor netcode” to a video which was found out later the problem was actually with the server, as there were people complaining about that server’s lag. While netcode is better in properly set up servers or which have a good stable net connection.
    There are other things in his list that are just opinions of people and questions about the game, yet he uses everything to make the game look bad.
    The only thing good he linked was David Dominguez SAT values analysis, and that got fixed in v1.2 But the credit goes to David Dominguez, not to Ass.
    He keeps talking about major physics flaws and bad ffb, but he has shown no data evidence for that. He only links to what some people write in the forum, and those people show no evidence nor data analysis.
    Besides, he plays with keyboard rf2 + steering assists. So the game partially or fully steers for him. Yet he talks that AC is the only sim ever to be the worst and having major flaws… doesn’t it sound very dubious? You took him for granted and posted that article without doing any research in the links he posted.

    Like

    1. And the worst thing is, rather then accept this person would cause issues, you’d rather attack the people who point out that this person is less then reputable calling them WMD tier shills. The AI issues might well be bad, however anyone bar this person would have provoked less of a reaction and a lot less aggression towards his “finds”. Also don’t go on about him legitimately finding bugs for the dev’s, when he was asked to lower his number of cars to see if it was reproducible(I don’t see this as being unreasonable, the test would help both ways, if it still did it then Kunos would need a re-think, and if it didn’t then the game rather then the AI would need a re-think maybe) He refused and you jumped on it as if it was an unreasonable and unfair attack on him… why?,

      we all know why he has no intention to help out but to troll and annoy

      Like

      1. “Even though this guy is right and other, more trustworthy members are reporting the same issues, he is wrong because he is a sperg on reddit” is not a valid argument.

        Like

      2. Agreed james, Im a little amazed at these reactions, even though I enjoy AC, its clear this site has a LOT of AC “fanboys”, and are displaying some of the same behaviour found on SMS forums, the vast majority of responses is about OP not the message, and completely side step issues and just try discredit poster straight from the classic WMD instruction book, AC AI is BAD, big improvement in 1.2 but still work needed on AI and alot of other stuff, and is exactly what this post is about.

        Rickybobby is without a doubt a big giant manboy, this isnt the first time I’ve seen over emotional BS responses defending AC to the death, its really sickening to see on a site that goes for the throat of other titles(rightly i most cases), but tiptoe around AC for some reason.

        Liked by 1 person

    2. Let’s not forget that the devs acknowledged that there are cpu issues with large numbers of ai. Considering how everyone doesn’t run a super computer this isn’t unreasonable. Other games have issues with large ai numbers while doing less complex data crunching I don’t see how this is even an issue.

      Like

      1. Enougher taking lessons of WMD members, what you say is irrelevant, he found a bug, in normal conditions, the number of AI was “normal” race conditions on a full release product for several months, with others pointing out same stuff, if devs ask OP to Further “Test” their game why should he?he pointed out the bug now Kunos can test the issue.

        I cant stand those fuckers at SMS doing the same, release the full game receive a complaint then try to have paying customer to write a fucking beta testing report out for the lazy fucking cunts, then attack person if refuse to spend their gaming time to sort their fucking s**t out, fuck that, I grow tired of ppl treating so called professional studios like “struggling artist” they are payed bloody good money to do this s**t, and you cant attack ppl if they refuse to beta test a full product for them.

        Like

  11. It’s fine if you want to post videos of the game acting badly. But to say that that’s anything like ‘bug reporting’… no. At a minimum, a usable bug report describes the precise circumstances where the bug occured, not just run together a bunch of clips of F1 cars crashing. For devs to take action, to fix something, they need to be able to experience the bug on their own systems – it’s pretty much that simple, the logs can give clues (like a more detailed circumstance report) but if the dev can’t see the bug themself, there is no way for them to make a change and see that the bug is gone, so it will never get ‘fixed’.

    Saying that you prefer the way something works in another game, also not a bug report. It’s a feature request. A lot of people seem to get this one wrong and then complain that in the AC bug report forums, it’s closed with ‘as designed’. It doesn’t mean the devs think it’s perfect, just that it’s working as well as they meant it to.

    The iRacing Street Stock article’s fine. The loss of grip on a specific lap is a bug report, the devs can load telemetry, check that lap, confirm it (or say what happens then if it’s something they meant to happen). This video & some of the followup “I had the same thing” comments aren’t bug reports, they’re just complaints, and for me, complaints aren’t really news. Some people will find something to complain about no matter how good the product is. When there’s a bug report that the devs are ignoring, like PCars’s long list of bugs with no changes made, that’s news worthy to me.

    Like

    1. Except the very thing you are talking about has a thread in the AC forums describing all the conditions in the video, plus a whole page of people reporting the same issue also describing the conditions that they used.

      Like

  12. No where has it been mentioned once the game is unplayable because of this, Keep jamming that word in their and you cant even find it in the article. Nor on the AC forum thread

    Like

  13. When you use a tainted source it spreads. It calls into question the evidence and the person presenting the evidence.

    Sometimes it is absolutely required as the source material could never be found otherwise and would be required. In this case using that individual and their evidence – although doesnt diminish the evidence does call into question your skills/motives.

    Like

The comment box is not a toy.

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s