Reader Submission #46 – More Censorship

Our lone Reader Submission this weekend comes from PRC.net reader Sonke S., who has shown us a troubling trend in the way game developers are interacting with their community. As our site has documented quite extensively, a fair amount of developers within the gaming industry believe silencing genuine criticism is the easiest way to downplay their games’ nagging issues. We’ve also demonstrated, in great detail, the sim racing community’s reception to Assetto Corsa and the strange lack of functionality for pretty much anything within the popular 2014 racing sim.

Today’s submission mixes both subjects together.


acs 2014-06-21 22-04-21-30

Hey guys, I’m not sure whether I’m obligated now to state how much I love your blog, but that would be undifferentiated because sometimes I do and sometimes I really don’t, because some articles lack the basic principles of causality. Therefore, I’ll skip that part.

You wrote a lot about how some developers censor opinions they don’t like, and I have one to add to that list:

Kunos Simulazioni.

unnamedI recently asked on their Facebook page whether or not there will be AI pit stops coming soon, and somebody said no. I afterwards stated how I think that rFactor 2 is more advanced, and while many people made fun of Project CARS when it launched, it at least had more functionality and has truly improved a lot since its release (I’ve run into more bugs playing AC offline).

unnamed

They deleted the post and blocked me from further commenting on their page, although it was a valid statement that did not include any insults. Seemingly, I struck a nerve, otherwise they wouldn’t have felt the need to delete the comment.

Luckily the page with the comment was still loaded in my mobile browser, so I was able to take screenshots. The desktop screenshot shows how the comment field doesn’t appear any more; I can only read other comments.

unnamed


Oh boy, this one’s gonna cause some problems with the Assetto Corsa fanboys that visit here on a regular basis. I can already see it now – “He was just trying to start an AC vs. rF2 war! Kunos doesn’t have time for obvious trolls!

2013-11-10_00017.jpg~originalThe points you brought up were legitimate, regardless of whether you mentioned rFactor 2 or not. Look, it’s 2015, you can’t just build a racing sim from the ground up, and leave out a whole bunch of shit that people had become accustomed to in other racing sims. Pit stops, online league functionality… those sort of things weren’t just fancy features thrown in by rival developers to push their racing sim over the top, those were things people more or less needed out of a racing sim. I’m sure some fanboys will say “you’re nitpicking, you’re just a whiny entitled brat”, but this same bullshit has happened in other video game genres, and with similar results.

I remember when Madden 06 came out on the Xbox 360 as a launch title, and the game was shit on by all mainstream sites for being really fucking bad. There was no commentary from John Madden and Al Michaels, no practice mode, no create-a-team, you couldn’t challenge calls made by the referees… all stuff people had become accustomed to over the years had suddenly vanished.

The major difference is that fanboys didn’t sit around and argue with those unhappy with the game, because people generally agreed that Madden 06 on the Xbox 360 sucked. As someone who’s actually played competitive football (one of my high school teammates made the CFL, and there’s a bunch of other kids in the CIS), it took until Madden 10 to get something that played somewhat realistically, and Madden 13 was really the first game to get my approval since NFL 2K5.

And then the same shit happened with NHL 15.

Did EA ban people from their forums for bringing up issues with their games? Oh yes they did. The major difference is that the community banded together to speak out against EA being dipshits, and they succeeded. Along with EA being named one of the worst companies in America two years in a row, the games actually improved and people, for the most part, stopped bitching.

Instead, in Sim Racing, people just go on witch hunts and accuse each other of being shills under alternate accounts.

jimI’m not a fan of developers silencing other people’s opinions because it can lead to an extremely shitty future. Back in my day, trolling meant something. Now, it appears that’s the label anyone gets slapped on them for having a different opinion. Dear people of the internet: stop that shit.

You weren’t trolling. Project CARS, while every bit as buggy as Assetto Corsa, at least has the potential to be a good racing sim, because all of the necessary functionalities to compete with something like rFactor or Race 07 are already in the game, they just don’t exactly work the way they’re supposed to at the moment. For someone like myself, I point and laugh because that’s how this site works, but the reality is that Project CARS could actually be pretty damn good if they just fixed everything. So you’re not exactly wrong.

Developers outright removing people just for posting something they can’t deal with creates a false sense of security for their own egos, and inevitably the direction of their game. Shit gets better when people criticize it and you take those criticisms into account to improve your product. If you surround yourself with nothing but people who kiss your ass and make excuses for you – called “yes men”, which is what it appears Kunos is doing, we’re looking at a future where the game is out on PS4 and the Xbox One next year, and the game’s popularity dies within a week because “what the fuck is this shit, there’s like nothing to do…”

You probably just have an irrational hate for Kunos and Assetto Corsa though. Get a life, go outside… etc…

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29 thoughts on “Reader Submission #46 – More Censorship

  1. Maybe because is not the place to discuss technical things about AC, in a post with an image of a teaser of Barcelona track.
    I think no one banned or blocked no one from discussing it in the AC forums or Steam forums for the game. So you’re free to talk there about your wishes on the game.

    Talking about that stuff is very off topic, because that post was just a teaser for Barcelona track, not a post about openly discussing the good and the bads of the game. You have a forum for that and no one will ban you for asking about pitstops.

    Just to answer the question, Stefano already mentioned in the livestream that pitstops aren’t possible for v1.3.

    Like

      1. Maybe this wasn’t the only situation and there have been others in the past in other posts where the place to discuss technical things about the game. You don’t know the amount of trolls and off topics there have been in facebook posts. Everyone demanding this and that. Is ok if they do it on the forums (ac and steam, reddit, racedepartment etc.) But on facebook? What has a barcelona teaser pic got to do with talking about the game problems? If that person (Sonke S.) would have read the forums or seen Kunos livestream, he would have known that pitstops aren’t coming in 1.3

        What if I’d go to Pcars facebook and complain endlessly about triple screen support or about rf2’s lack of support for multi-gpus, that wouldn’t be the appropriate place for it. After a while and if more and more users would complain on facebook in unrelated posts, possibly we could also end up blocked. There is the forum for such discussions, where neither kunos nor isi censor you.

        Like

  2. As previously mentioned, the official AC forums and Steam forums are practically unmoderated in terms of criticism. The only people I’ve seen get permanently banned were Nunca15, who was taking donations for ripping models, and Blame, who was a belligerent asshole in everything he posted for more than a year. Otherwise temp bans for derailing and spamming are all you’ll see.

    I have no idea who runs the Facebook page, maybe they do it for free. I can still see a couple of critical comments that haven’t been deleted on that photo. Anybody looking in the Facebook comments for any kind of worthwhile discussion or criticism is mental anyway.

    Like

  3. I’m sick of these fucking Kim Jong Un wannabes. These guys DO deserve some gamergate-like pressure on them, they’re disgusting tyrants, from Ian Bell to Kunos or iRacing. Shame on the imbecile fanboys to encourage them and allow them
    to behave like this and get away with it.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. Are you kidding “it contained no insults”. The user said it’s worse than RF2 and always will be. That’s not some sort of incontrovertible fact, that’s an insult.

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    1. Agree, seems more like shit stirring than substance. “RF2 is years ahead.” This explains why nobody plays RF2. Why would you make that post unless you wanted to get in an argument. I would put money on this being another “user” submitted article that Jamesociator or Sevcuck made up in their minds.

      Like

  5. The developers of this game answered the question and said that this feature will not be in this version.
    I am also disappointed about the lack of support for leagues, especially seeing the kunos live streams and the constant boasting about the attention to detail. So on the one hand they seem to want to cater to the hardcore audience, but at the same time insist certain features these people require are not worth it.
    People like this guy however are like a little kids who keep asking why why why, and then gets miffed that the developers are not having any of it after some point.

    Every racing game out there has it’s strengths and weaknesses, and even though we have come a long way since this all started, everyone who tries to look objectively about what is going on within these ‘sims’ also understand that this is all very dynamic progress and and hopefully overtime we might be able to get something to be truly called a simulator.
    It is not without reason the tire models and all kind of dynamics within the various physics models keep on changing, and this is a good thing because new data, information or algorithms come about and those give developers a chance to make things even more advanced. So every claim made about how one sim is so much better than the other might get nullified with the next update, and thus the cycle repeats.
    I support the developers because i like to think in the end we all want the same thing.
    The simracing community only seems to get more divided because some people love to claim what is the best, and how the others are so bad.

    I wish people would get over themselves.

    See you on track.

    Like

  6. You havent figured out yet you buy software for what is in it now. What is expected or could be added is pie in the sky.

    Welcome to AAA development.

    And all the fanbois cheer for pre order
    And all the fanbois cheer for the season pass
    And all the fanbois cheer of the extra content at 10 bucks each

    and all total you have just paid 130 bucks for 60 dollar game filled with bugs and half finished because they are on to the sequel. And the fanbois cheer!

    If you havent figured it out yet well fuck you there is no hope.

    Liked by 1 person

      1. AAA dev with add on content.

        Purchase what the sim has not what you want it to or what the devs hype themselves.

        But then I guess I really did have to spell it out for you didnt I.

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  7. Uhhh. Let’s look at pcars vs AC for league racing as things stand right now. The number of active sessions on schedule at RD alone paint a pretty clear picture. Having a bunch of unfinished ‘features’ does not make the experience better for league racing, it makes it vastly worse.

    Go ask the people (trying) to run pcars leagues about the problems. So yeah, that pretty clearly a troll comment.
    First, ask a question that has already been answered, then when someone specifically answers you in your preferred form of communication, make a negative statement based on verifiably false claims.

    Worthy of perma? No, not really. Useless troll comment from an uninformed ‘my toy is broken but I don’t actually care’ kid? Obviously.

    You need to be asking about latency compensation and dropped packets in MP, not goddamn pitstops. Instead of the useless whining, nail them on the shit that needs to be done first and write it in a way that doesn’t sound like a pure subjective troll posting, because then you just give them an excuse to delete it.

    Example in the case of SMS: not being able to control your car in pits is the last thing they need to worry about right now, even though many complain about it. Improving the consistency of the game is more important. If I ran onto their facebook and started saying that the game will simply never be as good due to the lack of pit controls in the next patch specifically, it would be a useless troll post, too.

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  8. Same thing happened to me when T500 got released. went in their Facebook explained the problem. next thing bam blocked from commenting and post deleted.

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  9. A kid moaning on facebook deserves to be removed IMO. I mean, if you like something, there’s constructive ways of helping to improve it, on the other side, if you don’t like something, just ignore it.
    Going over and over again on the same point, when someone have explained to you that what you’re asking isn’t possible (today) and explained to you why (on the other channels) is no different that the crying baby asking to have that toy when the dad explained to him that there’s no more money this month.

    Kid: I want the AI that way
    Dev: We understand, but we can’t do it now…;
    Kid: But I want it now!!
    Dev: We have explained already why it can’t be implemented;
    Kid: I don’t care!! This sim sucks because I can’t have what i want!!
    Dev: Ok.. good bye > BAN.

    The problem isn’t the dev.. the problem is that we have too many kids around. It’s not only about the racing sims, it’s the same for every other game out there.

    PS: with “kids” i don’t really mean 10yo kids.. i mean those “adults” that apparently didn’t grown past the young age.

    Like

  10. There is a lot of truth to this article. I am also no longer allowed to post on the AC facebook as in it’s early days each time they announced some content I suggested fixing the netcode and improving the MP. Who knew that suggesting fixes to your game was so wrong of me.

    Also I used to be a staff member at RD and saw the reply to the open letter to Kunos. They really do act like a bunch of kids and are more interested in the money they are making than actually making big functionality improvements to their game.

    AC has fanboys as it was the first sim to truly break out on steam. Now everyone who plays it think that it is the racing equivalent of man walking on water when in fact it’s much closer to a drunken stumble down the pavement.

    Liked by 1 person

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