Reader Submission #52 – Assetto Corsa sound modder banned for criticising the game’s default sounds

Another day, another Reader Submission, this time coming from an Assetto Corsa owner who wishes to remain anonymous. Today, we’re discussing the ban of not just any old troll from the official Assetto Corsa forums, but rather someone who had every right to criticize a portion of the game because he proved he could do it better on his own. Of course, in 2015, not kissing the developer’s asses on their own message board warrants a ban, and that’s not cool. Ever.


acs 2014-05-11 01-14-22-49Hello PRC. Yesterday I stumbled upon something in the Assetto Corsa forums that was quite a shock.

Just like the previous updates, the 1.3 update broke the sounds for all third party mod cars, so I went to the forums to download the mods again. I went to Fonsecker’s thread, a German modder who is praised about his great sounds ,and also my personal favorite, because he made the RUF Yellowbird sound like an actual Porsche, unlike the vanilla abomination of a sound that Kunos thought was acceptable.

The simple fix in the broken sounds is to re-install them, so I just downloaded the files again, but just in case, I checked if he updated the sounds to 1.3 to get the best out the new FMOD updates. What I found instead is that he got banned for criticizing the sounds in version 1.3. He was harsh about it, as he said Kunos should fire the person who makes the sounds for the cars in Assetto Corsa, but you could tell from the whole post that he was being a bit sarcastic, as he was even praising the update.

banBut this post didn’t sit well with Kunos, so Fonsecker got banned. If you click on his forum name it will take you to a page that says this account does not exist. Kunos stock sounds were always bad, but when a guy who has made cars sound better on his free time and for free, compared to professionals who get paid to do that, you don’t ban him, you listen and try to raise the bar.

ban reactionsThankfully Fonsecker didn’t give up, and he is making new sounds for the Lamborghini Huracan and the Audi R8, to give them a more fleshed out sound.

Keep up the good work!


12119713_10154269875634951_1341823074_oI know for a fact that the Kunos guys stop here once in a while, and they aren’t the only developers to do so. You’d think that after the fifth or six article we’d published showcasing Ian Bell’s antics within the community surrounding Project CARS, there would be a miniature team meeting to discuss Mr. Bell’s behavior from a business perspective. While it’s fun as a gamer to laugh at Ian calling people idiots and banning users left and right simply for bringing up issues, developers should look at the drama unfolding in the pCars forums as an example of how not to treat your community. Study it, analyze it, and talk with the group about handling a similar situation in your own forums.

That way, internal forum drama doesn’t wind up all over PretendRaceCars on a Friday afternoon.

On a personal level, I feel a bit disappointed in Kunos for acting in the ways you see above, and as you can see I’ve added another screenshot to the mix regarding a completely different situation. The articles about Ian Bell and the garbage surrounding Project CARS weren’t meant to give people a cheap laugh at a developer’s expense – take these situations and learn something from them. Man, I know you guys lurk here. This isn’t cool. You should know better.

Moving on…

I don’t know why Fonsecker got banned. Anytime someone bitches about a sub-par aspect in any game, fanboys respond with the typical:

“If you think it’s so easy to ________, create a game studio and do it yourself!”

Well, this guy did. The sound mods, judging by the videos above, are pretty damn good! Fonsecker has every right to talk shit about Assetto Corsa’s sub-par sounds because he made his own, and they kicked ass. Don’t ban the guy, free up some time and have a chat with him and ask him how he worked his magic! Hell, get him on board and maybe look at getting him to help with all of the cars! The guy obviously loves the game enough as is where he’s taking time out of his day to create some pretty worthwhile mods, why not use this to your advantage?

I know anytime there’s a DiRT Rally update, I take the time to create custom cameras for each new car for my own personal use, and people seemed to like them when I threw a few of ’em up on RaceDepartment. If Codemasters asked me if I could re-do the vanilla game’s default cockpit cameras for them, I’d do it for a free t-shirt or a coffee mug or something.

Man this whole thing… Blows my mind. Absolutely retarded.

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71 thoughts on “Reader Submission #52 – Assetto Corsa sound modder banned for criticising the game’s default sounds

  1. Let’s read only one of his posts…:

    “They sounds terrible as always”
    “..is so terrible aboard..”
    “please fire your young (sound?) guy and hire some people with real sound editing knowledge”

    …he didn’t just criticized the game (forgiving his kid attitude.. but it have been a language barrier), he also offended the development team, and all the above only in a 5 rows message.
    And you are surprised he has been banned? And you call this kid a “respectable modder”? He doesn’t deserve a shit, a would have done the same instantly wtf.
    No matter how good could have been his “mods”, he just raged and used offensive words against the developer, only because someone have broken his toys, this is not acting as an adult.. but i recognize that it is to hard to find an adult on a forum nowadays.

    “A raging kid has been banned for offending the dev team” …would it be a more appropriate title for this article.

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    1. Meanwhile, the readers of PretendRaceCars have:

      – accused me of being paid under the table by Kunos to promote their game
      – accused me of being paid under the table by Reiza to promote their game
      – accused me of being paid under the table by Sector 3 to promote their game
      – claimed I have an irrational vendetta against Project CARS
      – claimed I have an irrational vendetta against iRacing
      – claimed I was banned from iRacing for reasons that we already publicly proved to be inaccurate
      – claimed I’ve been booted out of *insert community here* for *insert reason here*
      – claimed I’ve “stolen” mods from various NASCAR Racing 2003 Season communities
      – claimed I’ve only posted negative Assetto Corsa articles to get back at some guy on the AC forums
      – claimed the two other staff members are Hexagramme and Associat0r
      – claimed the two other staff members are me under different accounts and writing styles
      – claimed Reader Submissions are written by myself under fake names and different writing styles
      – claimed I’ve been hit by an ex-girlfriend
      – claimed I have autism
      – claimed I have borderline personality disorder
      – claimed I’m actually a guy named Todd Weaver from Portland
      – claimed RaceDepartment removed all my articles because they couldn’t stand me (ALL articles by EVERYONE were removed when they changed databases in 2014)
      – claimed controversial iRacing stories verified by Peak Anti-Freeze series drivers before they were published are “made up conspiracies”
      – claimed info we’ve gotten from genuine sources close to Assetto Corsa about the game’s future is “coincidence”

      That’s off the top of my head. Still haven’t handed out an IP ban on here, probably never going to.

      “The car sounds in your game suck and mine are better” isn’t something that should ever get your knickers in a twist.

      Liked by 2 people

      1. This blog lives of trolling and such.. banning people here would be counter-productive due to the very limited traffic (real traffic, not numbers, I mean the real users who are used to read the shit wrote here), so yes it would be stupid to ban trolls when this blog only lives because of them and click bait false articles.

        For a “serious” (developer, game, whatever) forum, the story is completely different (the opposite I would say), so trolls and kids who are used the offend other members (if not the staff) are immediately removed because they doesn’t help the community, there’s no harm to ban em, because there still thousands other (productive) members which will remain aboard.

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      2. >click bait false articles
        Which articles are you talking about? There are no false articles on here. You mongrels always spout this shit without actually ever providing any evidency to your claims. Oh wait, I forgot, this is how you retarded fanboys operate. Sorry

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      3. You don’t need to surf the whole website, while this article itself is a click-bait (and it has a false title), considering that the guy has been banned because of his behavior (against the forum rules) and because he directly offended the development team.
        I don’t know if you can’t read and if I really have to explain the difference between being critic and being a douchbag, but just in case:

        – I believe the sound engine isn’t good enough, because [explanation] < Constructive criticism, you won't be banned for this;

        – Your sounds sucks, and you should fire your sound engineer and hire me < Kid affected by the superman syndrome that deserves a ban.

        So yes, this is a not-article, with a false title to click-bait. And 90% of the "articles" here are like this… why? Because this is the purpose of this blog, we're not doing "information" here, we're just trying to collect some traffic to hope a day we'll have enough money to buy a cheesburger (impressions, donations).

        And "fanboy" of what? I don't care at all about AC, i'm commenting what happened not the game.

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    2. I’ve seen fonsecker’s posts. He usualy helps and even gives other sound modders advice.

      He didn’t make another post that could’ve made a moderator to give him a warning. This was the only time he critisized Kunos, and he got instantly banned.

      http://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/index.php?search/1224038/

      Here are all his posts. Find one post that you think it could’ve been worthy of issuing him a warning to behave better. Also, you have to login to see these, but it looks like you’re a kunos ass-kisser anyway, so you have the game.

      Liked by 2 people

    3. People don’t forget this is on an internet forum. People insult and call you shit all the time on the internet. It isn’t face to face, so don’t get insulted by it. Simple. No need to ban.

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  2. ..dunno if the funniest part is this pearl called “article”, or the fact that the “anonymous submitter” is the banned guy himself. :°D

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      1. holy shit sev you’ve really taken it west. I really enjoyed the first article about you, telling your story with being a race driver and how it compared to sims. But wtf happened, I mean you are free to do what you’re doing, but was this personality always you or just influenced?

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      2. Had a shit day, sorry. I just get annoyed when people call bullshit on the articles when they never provide any evidence to proof their point of view.

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      3. But still you got the article say something different than what happened. Because fonsecker wasn’t banned for not liking the game sounds from the new cars, he was forum banned for being offensive to the dev team. And that’s the big point you guys missed when creating this article. Maybe for you his words weren’t ban worthy.. but for the dev team working in AC, it was.

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      4. The guy who wrote the article (probably the guy banned himself) know perfectly why he has been banned (for being a douchebag, not for criticizing the sounds), but title the post “I have been banned for being a douchebag” would have sounded right, so let’s pretend to be the victim.
        Who have decided to publish the letter without turning the brain on (this website owner) is another matter.. but has his own reasons: an article titled like this is going to collect more clicks, trolls, etc. or do you think this blog exists for anything else than trolling?

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  3. Bit of a conflict of interest for me cause he’s done the sounds on my AC mods. I am not surprised he got banned, I hope it’s temporary though.

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  4. first of all we dont know if its permanent, second he explicitly insisted stefano fire his college (and probably friend). couldnt have seen this one coming…

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      1. That’s why you should keep business and your private life seperated from each other unless it is completely necessary to combine the two.

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        1. huh?? if you think the sound guy is on the team just because he’s friends with stefano, thats your fantasy, not mine. kunos is a small & tight bunch so its human & natural that they would stick up for one another. itd be natural if they arent friends at all but simply partners who respect each other.

          i believe in second chances, absolutely, but its not difficult to understand stefano’s decision,

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  5. So he stated his opinion, made a sarcastic remark, and was banned for….. Exactly what? Offending the devs?

    This just sounds like Kunos is being a little precious.

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Am I the only one that isn’t really a fan of Fonsecker’s sound mods? I’m not defending Kunos because banning him was wrong (that’s what happens when you get programmers to do community forum management), but I really have never thought his sound mods were anything to write home to about.

    They’re not bad, but they’re not exactly great either.

    El Mariachi. Now there’s a sound modder.

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    1. Well the videos provided above definitely don’t sound good to me. There are quite a few cars in AC that I think could use an update but aren’t THAT bad. I love the sounds of the recent stuff they released but think they lack bass. Fonsecker made some nice sounds mods but I find his work overrated.

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  7. I never installed a fonsecker mod, because they are too fantasy like. Doesn’t add anything special compared to Kunos sounds, only something different. And that different is pretty subjective, which isn’t worth to install over Kunos sounds.

    Why you don’t know the reason he got banned? He insulted the dev team and wanted to get their sound dev fired to hire him instead. And the way he wrote, in a trollish and offensive way. Sometimes trolls just joke, but in this case he was repulsively offensive.

    Look, if he thinks he’s that good, why does he need to offend the devs instead of continuing his work, is he afraid that the general public still prefers Kunos sounds instead of his mods?

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  8. Come on now. He wasn’t ban for nothing… Buying their game doesn’t give you the right to give them shit. He told them that they should fire the sound guy, since when is this suppose to be critism? He was just being a dick.

    I’m seeing more and more developpers getting shit lately. You know the annoying customer that is screaming at the employees because they didn’t get what they wanted? Well, looks like there is a lot of them in the simracing community… Don’t forget, they are working for our pleasure.

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    1. Exactly, a normal person who respects the work of his area, would discuss with the devs and try to rationalize the aspects of car sounds and where they could be improved etc. Though I don’t know if he tried that or not.
      But for example I think elmariachi sound modder and possibly some other, have collaborated with kunos in the past, for example helping with the ferrari F40 sound. elmariachi isn’t active in the game any more, but I doubt he’d be that impulsive and offensive to kunos. Even if he wouldn’t collaborate with them, he’d still do his work and let the community judge it.

      Fonsecker has a superiority complex, and is not even justified. His sound mods aren’t worth to install over Kunos sounds in their official cars. Even if Kunos haven’t explored Fmod to its full potential, the current sounds are adequate and seem realistic, more than a youtube recording. However there are some that seem a bit synthetic, whereas a bit more detailed engine sound could be used.

      I can give one example, the 458 italia to me sounds a bit synthetic, like “eeeeeeeuuuuueeee”. But listen to this clip that gives a better impression. http://team-gsmf.org/files/fonsecker/458_italia.mp3 (that link is from fonsecker, he posted it in the forum from a real car recording. Though he never released any 458 sound mod, but he posted the recording for another person doing a 458 sound mod).

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  9. Fonsecker himself admitted he should have been banned. He didn’t offer any constructive criticism, he called everything trash, and outright called for Luca Sodano, long-time colleague and friend of Stefano, to be fired and replaced by himself. That said, after his apology he should still be unbanned as a valued member of the community.

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  10. Ban was justified. This is not the attitude you use to suggest the changes to the project.
    The fact that he made some sounds subjectively better doesn’t make him invulnerable from forum rules and different from other users (who get banned for trashing on the forum).

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  11. You can’t just go official forums talk shit about devs ( even if you are world’s most talented audio modder) disrespecting them and then be suprised you got banned.

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  12. Game devs are stupidly shortsighted these days. They should HIRE him, and instead they ban him from the forum because he critizices their work. PFFT, that´s kindergarten stuff.

    They´re SO stupid they think a forum full of shills will help the game more than a forum full of people locating the problems, sometimes even creating solutions themselves, and telling things how they are.

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    1. Listen here, people in AC forum report several things, just browse through the technical sections. What ass&hex do and some others of their crew, they are denigrating AC’s image and manipulating people to be against AC and pro rf2. The real helpers of AC are in the AC forums/Racedepartment forums, those who identify issues and report them in the forum. Those who discuss the game and racing, setups, cars, and so on.. Ass and hex will always try to advertise issues of AC all over the internet. Don’t get fooled by their excuse “oh, we also reported the AI video in ac forum”.. well everyone else who reports issues in ac forum doesn’t go spread their reports all over the internet.

      So no, we aren’t shills. We like Assetto Corsa, we like to play this game. We are fans of their work in this project. And we also suggest improvements, we report issues and bugs. But that’s a positive thing. A negative thing is when you’re trying to denigrate AC and Kunos with the goal of advertising your preferred game.

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      1. This ban denigrates AC and Kunos more than 1000 posts from these retards.

        What denigrates a product is not a post from a hater, it´s poor quality and lame behaviour from people up the ladder. This guy you banned could have made the product better than it is, and by swallowing criticism you could have shown drive to improve.

        Instead you guys chose to denigrate yourselves to SMS levels. Well done.

        Liked by 1 person

      2. Criticism shouldn’t be swallowed. If the critic really wants to help Kunos and the AC community, he would have tried to collaborate with kunos, either privately or making his own thread with details about car sounds and fmod, and not starting insulting the game developers and asking the removal of a dev from their team.

        Do you think his mods are the savior of the community? Well no, many people still prefer Kunos sounds and don’t use fonsecker mods. They don’t offer anything improved. Only something different.

        When has ever kunos banned someone for talking about game issues, bugs, suggestions? They will only do it when those people start stalking and becoming obsessive, when they start demanding things with a shitty negative attitude, and when they start giving offensive remarks to the game developers.

        Those users denigrate themselves in the face of the community, and not Kunos by the banning action used.

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      3. Dude listen to yourself. This sounds like middle school behavior. “My game is better than your game! Waaaa!” “You’re trying to turn people against the game I like waaaa!” This is simply ridiculous, both their behavior and the reaction of AC fans to it. If you just ignored them, they wouldn’t be getting a reaction and they’d probably stop

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    2. But the issue is these aren’t the people you want involved in your dev team at all. Publicly posting about a member of the dev team, calling for him to be fired and calling his work shit is not how a proper “team player” works and goes about his business. In this dev community, teams are small and seem quite closely knit.
      Would you go into a job interview and say to the bosses face that one of his employees is a piece of shit, all his work is crap compared to yours, and that you should be hired coz you’re hot stuff? Some people would…I’m sure we’ve all seen their type before…

      Take software testing as an example, seeing as we seem to do a lot of it with our sims. A guy who spams posts about known issues in a product over and over again to anyone that will listen anywhere, while insulting those behind the product is not the type of dude you want beta testing for the team.
      Some see that type of thing as totally fair criticism or someone “just telling it how it is”, especially if they themselves are frustrated with the product. It’s not whats needed though. While he may have passion for the product, if you can’t express those criticism in the right way, people will stop listening…as we have seen with any of the guys who seem to 100% love or hate any of our sim titles…

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  13. Really, they should understand by now that it’s better to just let someone have a bit of a rant instead of banning.

    I don’t think his sound mods are better than the best that Kunos have made so far and telling Kunos to fire someone was out of line, but I don’t see anything that is technically worthy of a ban.

    A warning and editing out ‘personal attacks’ (if they are really feeling sensitive) would have been a far better response.

    Liked by 1 person

    1. That would be true for a 14yo bully, not for an adult. If I step in a bar yelling at the barman that is coffee is shit, he will kick my ass outta, and he is right.
      Offending someone else job by using that kind of words is not acceptable, you are not doing anything constructive, you are just flaming and turning the conversation into a fight.
      The guy deserved a ban, no doubts about it.

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  14. There’s a reason I don’t make sound mods myself; that said the main difference I see is his are EQ’d to be loud in bass range which I guess sounds ‘better’ if you’re running cheap 10w PC speakers that need a boost, or if you just have your volume low (perception of EQ is affected by volume – play something loud and it needs different balance than when it’s quiet).

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  15. Couldn’t these (presumably) grown adults at Kunos just ignore him? The amount of immaturity is shocking. Their game is unfinished, it’s boring, lacking essential features and replay value. And yes, the cars sound like ass. They’re entering Ian Bell territory with this shit.

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    1. Your opinion mate, don’t treat it is as fact. And besides, if everyone shared your opinion, there wouldn’t still be as many people playing it and interacting in the community, not as many customers as of now, not as many fans, not hundreds of hours clocked in for a lot of users. If everyone shared your opinion that you want to portray as fact, the game wouldn’t have 10 people in right now. So there you have it. Be happy with the game you prefer, because we are with Assetto Corsa. And don’t misjudge that because we are happy and like to play it, we also want continuous support, updates, fixes, content, community/racers interaction. And we know this isn’t a short term project, but a big journey between developers and community.

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      1. Honestly I think that not a single sim out there gets it right. What I don’t understand is why some people think that these games and developers cannot be criticized, and why people who play the games and are not involved in any way in their development take that criticism as a personal affront. Although I guess that goes for any video game; there’s people who just take this stuff way too seriously and too personally. These guys deserve to get shit (as do ISI and Slightly Mad) because the game is incomplete, period. I think Kunos really messed up by declaring the game “1.0” last year when it was clearly lacking so many features, and charging full price for it. It’s a slap in the face to consumers, although a lot of people seem content to pay for it for some reason. But if you’re going to do that, the game deserves to be judged as a a final product. That “oh it’s a work in progress” is nonsense. 1.0 means feature complete, means it’s done. Kunos is in for a big surprise when this releases on consoles next year and it gets blasted by reviewers and console players…

        Liked by 1 person

      2. 1.0 had everything they planned at the start, features and content. So why are you calling it unfinished and incomplete and a slap in the face? Even when rf2 is out of beta, there content and some features which I can claim are essential and call it incomplete and unfinished because they don’t have the things I want.

        For how long would you wanted AC to remain in Early Access? It was the right call to release the game after about a year since EA program launch, because they completed and released all that was set and planned at the start of the program. Just because 1.0 doesn’t satisfy your standards, doesn’t justify what you say. They didn’t promise you moon and mars, but if you took them for granted that becomes your issue for feeling or thinking that way.

        But did they stop at 1.0? No, and they told us they wouldn’t. But they had to start somewhere and not endlessly wait to satisfy every single person according to what they think their game should be. So after 1.0 they continued and added more content, features, patches. And if you want features you don’t have in AC, there are alternatives, you can play several sims per week, because all will do things in a different way, have different cars and tracks that you want and can’t have it all in one sim only.

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      3. I wonder if it’s the pinnacle of the selfish Western attitude to complain that a game is a ‘slap in the face’ because it doesn’t have all the things you were hoping it would. It’s what it is, it’s not like they announced all these wishlist items and then cancelled them. (well except the time P.CARS decided not to support WiiuU) The devs chose a feature set, checked off everything, now the game is complete. It’s not their first game, they know the pros and cons of features they did and didn’t include.

        I don’t like every sim’s feature set, but that just means I don’t play every sim. I don’t have to go abuse the devs until they change the game and make me happy. I can go online and look for tweaks to fix the issues (eg. rf1/GSC ffb plugin, skins that are accurate instead of ‘everything tweaked enough to get past the lawyers’), or I can find a different game.

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      4. You have 278 hours in AC, and decided to stop because it doesn’t have every single feature that you wanted. That would be like walking out of Star Wars at the 2.5 hour mark because it doesn’t have a Jar Jar sex scene.

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  16. Dunno why the reply button doesn’t show for some peoples posts, ah well.

    “What I don’t understand is why some people think that these games and developers cannot be criticized, and why people who play the games and are not involved in any way in their development take that criticism as a personal affront.”

    Because some of us seem to hold a little more empathy than others…if you have ever been a part of any software development, shit almost a part of any project in any field, you see how much people put into their work, and how many hours are spent working on it. It doesn’t mean anyone is personally invested…
    Some of us also appear to have different social graces and skills when it comes to expressing criticism. Because it is a vital part of any project, you need people to tell you if you are screwing up. We all screw up.
    Someone who can provide a list of what he thinks is wrong (with something as subjective as sound) and a list of improvements/notes for the dev team is far more likely to be listened to than someone who says “Your sounds are fucking shit, you are a cunt”. Both are criticism…which one has more info and which gives you an indication of who you’d want to work with/listen to?

    “These guys deserve to get shit (as do ISI and Slightly Mad) because the game is incomplete, period.”

    Ongoing development is the only way it is going to work nowadays, I can bet you won’t see that change from now on. Even to the point of what Dirt Rally are doing. Sim dev teams haven’t grown in scale like AAA dev teams, and yet the simulations have become much more complex in our sims. More and more time required to work on more and more areas. Much the same as modding has developed a lot slower now, much more for them to do in their spare time to create stuff that is up to high standards.
    “Well, hire more people then!”
    Which can cause more issues than it solves, especially when a project is already well into development like these sims are. More bodies doesn’t mean more work done, especially with specialized areas that are in racing sims. I bet with most of these studios, they don’t have a team of 15 guys all working on the tyre physics at once.

    Right from the start, you are going to get reviews and people giving their opinions on the products. You base your decision to buy it on where the software is currently and whether it is acceptable for you to pay their price for the state it is in.
    They don’t deserve to get shit at all, but you should express your opinion in a review for sure, especially if the software has taken a turn away from what you were expecting. The customer doesn’t run the head of the studio though, and if they take their stuff in a different direction, or don’t include features that you want to see, that’s your problem, not theirs.

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  17. I don’t think the aproach by Fonsecker was correct at all (whether the ban was justified depends on POV). But the fact is, he is right.
    The problem is the blunt and arrogant way he has put it… if that was also a way to candidate himself for the job, I don’t think that was a good aproach. 😉 (lol)

    I’m also a long time sound-designer and modder (but not for AC), and have worked with the audio for dozens of simulation games (racing and flight sims), and had to explore quite a few sound-engines in depth.
    I know what Fonsecker means and I’d have to agree with him.

    AC, like PCars and IRacing, uses FMOD. Which is not all that nice, much less the right choice for a game that relies on modding.
    But that really isn’t the main problem. The main problem is the guy(s) responsible for the choices and work for the audio in AC. It’s really mediocre.
    I hear in-game every single car in AC, I’ve checked the audio samples to take my own conclusions and, honestly, I can’t understand how all that crap passed for release status. I wouldn’t even accept it in the average mod, much less in a commercial game (as in, that you pay for).
    Someone else mentioned that the fella got the job simply because he’s a good friend of Stefano. While that’s a harsh comment, it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s true, because the quality of the material produced wouldn’t have passed preliminary avaliation tests in any other racing-game studio developper. It is THAT bad.

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    1. Before Fmod, I think they had an in-house sound engine, and was also pretty much Stefano and Luca working on the sounds, even before AC arrived on steam. Then ~half a year after AC on steam early access, they introduced fmod. But many if not all cars had the old recordings, so just newer cars started getting new sounds, and some older also got update slowly with new recording. But in general, only dp1 and dp2 cars use fresher recordings, and dp2 uses a different technique than dp1. Then older car games I think laferrari also got new sounds along the way, F40 and I don’t know which other.
      Luca (sound engineer in AC) has been with Kunos a long time already, at least checking his forum account date, is from Jan.2013. Though idk when the ac forum was created.

      But let’s see something, here are three examples of the same cars in the games you said also use Fmod, iracing, pcars, and ac.

      What are your conclusions about this, Ducko?

      About a youtube video of the car irl, I can’t find a better recording than this. Ignoring the shaky bit or hz frequencies of the mic when the car goes very fast, underneath you can hear the car sound being more similar to of AC’s.

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      1. Not sure what you mean with it… that AC is more accurate, was it? :-s
        In anycase, I’ll give you my two cents….

        First of all, you present a crappy quality youtube video for the real car sound consideration.
        I understand that you didn’t find better (that’s ok) and wanted just to make a point come across, I get it.
        My point is, it’s a common mistake to use those crappy sounding videos as “benchmark” for accuracy and realism of the sound for comparisons, when it isn’t anything like being inside the real car, in the flesh (as in “live”).
        Granted, it’s very rare to get such a good kind of recording (and one able to be splited for the various sections used in a racing-game) but there are professional studios selling those kind of recordings, exactly for audio production purposes (racing-games and movies).

        Take a good listen to the whole video, please:

        Considering that all cars in AC sound frighteningly resemblant to the average crappy low quality youtube videos (and like the one you presented, it seems), and not even remotely close to something of the quality as shown in that video I just linked, it then clearly looks to me that either Kunos is a cheapskate not investing in the required material, or their audio guy lacks ambition and doesn’t ask for such material (that is, assuming he know’s how to handle the stuff).
        In any case, their results for AC are, mediocre, to put it plain and simple.
        And as for accuracy, sorry to inform but that is just a part of the required work. Meaning, there’s a whole bunch of production values and quality stuff still to do.

        Now, back to your comparison…

        If you know what and where to hear, the conclusion is that iRacing presents the better quality and accuracy, and the best representation of the real counterpart (and by far, IMO).
        The problem iRacing has with their car sounds -and this is an issue in all three- is the lack of dynamics in the sound. Some people say the sounds are a tad too clean or lacking bass. That’s very subjective, and the least of issues you could ever have in sound for a game.

        PCARS follows a formula where the sounds are made rougher, with some distortion, to make them dramatic. I guess this is aimed and appreciated by the average punter who dislikes nice, crisp and clean sound of good quality. But, for someone like me, that artificial distortion filter is extremely annoying and unpleasant.

        AC on the other hand is utterly horrible. You can hear the sound artifacts in the samples, the mixes of samples that are not in harmony in their stereo depth, and then the noticeable looping points.
        It’s as if a puzzle of (bad) different sources was put together with mismatched parts forced into one-another and sticked with glue.
        And the list of issues goes on and on. To say that RUF RT12 is actually one of the least “bad sounds” in AC is probably a compliment.

        Regardless of the winning contest, all the three games you present lack “ummph” and bite in engine sound recreation. There isn’t this supposed “growth” or “crescendo” of sound agressiveness when the car goes up in the revs, which all internal combustion engines have naturally (more so on racing and super cars). Which some games do recreate better than others.
        There’s also lack of contrast and punch in the throtle in all of them, as if there isn’t enough compression when you press the throttle, and when you release it. This last particular issue is a very common problem with FMOD in racing-games, and it’s very hard to make it “palatable” (or disguise it) in that sound-engine. And that is already besides the issue of the complexity and buggy nature of it.

        By the way, for an example of right aproach, compare that with Codemaster’s DirtRally, Sector3Studio’s R3E, and Reiza’s GSC – those three game titles present a really decent audio work – certainly taking AC to school (and also PCars and iRacing, IMHO).

        PS: sorry for the long post.

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      2. You haven’t heard any real ruf rt12r in person while in cockpit, or even just a very good source online, yet you state as 100% certain that AC sounds the worst in comparison with games that have this car. Thank you for proving that you are targeting AC.

        In your video, yes the mix of all onboard tracks (at min 2:01) are really nice and complex. But I haven’t seen any game/sim do it yet that well.

        I don’t like raceroom’s sounds because they sound a bit like plastic and they have very characteristic sound parts across all cars. Mainly their cars have similar sound feeling, they appear to be a bit more complex on the details, but that’s the thing, all those details sound the same in all cars. And that’s what puts me off when people call their audio amazing. Do you have a really good source of onboard sound to compare between a rl car and a car in the game?

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  18. …targeting AC? o_O ..WTF?
    Seems to me you either have a chip on your shoulder, or you’re trying to start an argument just for the sake of it.

    I was asked “what are my conclusions (in the games audio comparison)”, and that was I did in my previous post.
    It seems that, for some reason, it hit a nerve there?
    I’m sorry if you disagree. If you’re so inclined, counteract my argument with something logical instead of a silly ad hominem.

    IMHO, if you understand audio and sound-design, messed with the good stuff, know how the counterparts should sound in-game, and heard all the game-title competitors, I don’t think there is even the smallest shred one can pick to defend AC in the audio-department.
    And it isn’t the only game lacking in that, other sim-racing games do lack in the audio department – just not as blatantly.

    If your belief and stance is that AC is delivers a good audio experience, and that it transpires good audio work from the devs… hey, good on you.
    I’ll just have to agree to disagree.

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    1. I countered your argument, read again: “You haven’t heard any real ruf rt12r in person while in cockpit, or even just a very good source online, yet you state as 100% certain that AC sounds the worst in comparison with games that have this car.”

      Why are you treating your subjective opinion as fact? And don’t be condescending by saying that you are an expert in car sound engineering and we are layman. Because so far you only wrote a subjective opinion.

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      1. My “subjective opinion” is based on facts. 🙂
        To get those facts, all you need is a pair of hears, good headphones and soundcard, to realize it and see for yourself.
        It also helps if you extract the samples from the game and check them for yourself.
        If you know how stuff works, you might be surprised.

        If you bothered to read the reply where I placed my “conclusions”, you certainly saw a brief mention of technical issues with AC samples and implementation.

        First, there’s the audio sources. You can clearly hear that the sources were taken from poor recordings (youtube, I bet), as the audio quality seems awfull right from the source, not from mastering. Again, please pick a nice set of headphones and a good soundcard, hear for youself – the artifacts and balance inconsistency.
        It is clearly audible that, for most cars sounds (actually all that I came across), the engine sounds are frequently composed of different recording sources, for different samples meant for different areas of the engine RPM sections. Some so terribly different that you can hear a mono based engine sample crossfading with a stereo one in the next RPM section.
        And yes, that’s for each car. It begs belief.

        Then there’s the looping issues. The person working on them also doesn’t have any idea about “texturing” engine samples in a sound-engine like FMOD, which itself works with a method where the engine samples are pick-up-and-play randomly (unlike other sound-engines of the competicion).
        Repeating patterns are to be avoid in any decent audio work for racing games, it seems that wasn’t noted there. And if it was, it felt flat on its face.

        I can’t explain it better than that, impossible without bringing technical explanations.

        Perhaps an analogy of it for graphics could be, imagining that in a high-profile simulation game (racing or flight sim) that you paid and get invested on, you realize something strange in a car (or plane) livery, that it looks “photorealistic” in the most cartoony and wrong way.
        You then go check the skin inside the game and you confirm it by seeing that it uses bits of completely different pictures joined togheter in the most chaotic way.
        Meaning, the source is accurate (from the real thing), but it’s completely fucked up.

        In plain “layman” terms the best description I can give is that AC presents the kind of audio stuff that you would see/hear in your middle of the road add-on mod of some years ago. Not something that you expect in a modern day game-title.
        Yes, true that none game is perfect in the audio era, but you don’t see those kind of amateur mistakes in AC’s competitors. What you see otherwise is subjective choices in equalization and effects, and/or choice of (sometimes inaccurate) recordings used for the cars.

        If it’s facts and proof you want without moving a finger yourself, then that would require a bunch of audio samples, videos and long arsed texts. And for that, I’m sorry but I can’t be arsed.

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      2. They recorded the sounds from the cars, didn’t take the samples from youtube. A simple thing for that is when some people complained about Miura’s sounds not being like the mod, whereas they took audio from youtube external camera recording, and Kunos took sounds from the car interior; so some people complained that the mod sounded better but those liking the mod got fooled because they were exterior recording placed for interior.

        See, is just subjective things based on each one’s interpretation of our assumptions.

        The fact that you tell me…: “To get those facts, all you need is a pair of hears, good headphones and soundcard, to realize it and see for yourself.”

        “First, there’s the audio sources. You can clearly hear that the sources were taken from poor recordings (youtube, I bet), as the audio quality seems awfull right from the source, not from mastering. Again, please pick a nice set of headphones and a good soundcard, hear for youself – the artifacts and balance inconsistency.”

        I cannot clearly hear that, because sounds were taken from the cars themselves. For example for DP2 they partnered with the company Akrapovic. But cool np, all the other sims took their sounds from their cars with ultra technological recordings and techniques, and prepared them in the software excellently, then kunos took sounds from crappy 240p youtube videos and processed the sounds with mspaint.

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  19. I’m cracking myself with this one…. “They (KS) recorded the sounds from the cars, didn’t take the samples from youtube.”

    Oh really?
    ….and recorded them with what, a phone potato? 😀 (hilarious shit!)

    Sorry mate, you’re delusional if believing that info to be true. Stop drinking the kool-aid and wake up for the reality.
    They wouldn’t even make a propper engine sample using a Limiter/Maximizer, much less getting a propper recording! 😀 😀 LMAO

    Seriously, you present one car sound where there was a “partnership” with Akrapovic. They probably just bought one of the many recordings that most exhaust manufacturers have (and probably because it’s cheaper than ones from Pole.Se).
    The thing is, you miss the whole list of the cars. Where do those shitty sounds come from? Quality recordings like the other studios are investing on?

    If you can’t even hear how crappy ALL those engine sounds in AC are – you basically confessed that – then there is nothing to further discuss about it.

    The sounds of AC are shit. Everyone with a good pair of ears, good headphones and soundcard can hear that, for every single engine sound. My strong suspicion is that even the guys at KS know they aren’t that good, because it’s that blatant.
    Just because people like you are accepting the sounds as they are, or even excusing them, doesn’t mean that they aren’t shit. And to keep telling yourself that they arent won’t change that…. they’re still SHIT regardless.

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  20. That Lord Kunos is a f*cking retarded, if their policy now is to ban everybody that has a different or bad oppinion then soon no one will be around AC forums, only the fanboys that drive like miss daisy…

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    1. Dude, if you insult and make little of someone else, then you can expect a warning/ban, depending how strong it was. No one was ever banned for saying the game isn’t doing something right.

      Like

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