1.11.3 – The Best Christmas Present

244210_20161224171856_1Tuesday marked the release of Assetto Corsa’s substantial Version 1.11 update, and by Thursday evening, we had an article up on PRC.net ripping apart the tenth iteration of the game’s continuously evolving tire model. A driving experience that seemingly aimed to replicate the classic nonsensical ice skating behavior of early iRacing builds rather than the high-downforce European sports cars featured within the simulator, the talented Assetto Corsa drivers among us were bewildered at what was occurring on their computer screens. No on-board footage matched up with the handling characteristics exhibited by GT3 cars in Assetto Corsa – they were floating all over the place, as if their tires had been yanked straight out of Grand Prix Legends. It made absolutely no sense, and on top of the bizarre car performance, some of the guys I talk to on a regular basis were notifying me of irregular heat cycles they’d discovered during simple lapping sessions. It made me speculate that Kunos had either botched a line or two deep within the tires.ini file, or they were merely firing blindly – allowing the rabid fanbase to bury valid criticism of the update under a sea of pathetic ass-kissing.

I let Assetto Corsa re-install through Steam overnight, determined to replicate the oddities for myself and possibly put up a lengthy article about it, which would center around questioning how a developer with real world data could spend a number of years constructing several different tire models for their racing simulator and never managing to get it right – as well as elaborating on what exactly is an eternal science project. I tend to drop that phrase around here a lot, and it’s more than just the Assetto Corsa community who swoon at otherwise redundant patch notes, so I figured that would be the article people came back to after the Christmas break.

I had Ethan fire me the exact Mercedes AMG GT3 setup he was using to produce the ice skating-like tire behavior on corner exit, but upon booting up the game, I noticed Steam had recently downloaded a small eight megabyte patch for Assetto Corsa, dubbed Version 1.11.3. Flipping through the garage area tabs, the numbers were what I deemed to be acceptable for a baseline setup, the tire pressures seemed reasonable, and I think the only adjustment I made was sending the brake balance towards the rear at 58% from whatever his stock value was. I also turned off Traction Control entirely, intentionally creating a situation that would see the rear end slide all over the place and magnify Ethan’s complaints about the car’s behavior.

Unloading the AMG GT3 at the Nurburgring GP circuit after the obligatory calibration period, I honestly thought the setup he’d spent the previous few days complaining about was instead absolutely wonderful

244210_20161224170445_1The car was phenomenal. Once the soft compound tires began to lose a bit of their composure, the old Assetto Corsa feeling – one I hadn’t experienced since the spring of 2014 when the RSR Live Timing leaderboards were the only source of competition – had returned. You could go out and drive at 92% attack without much trouble, and in my opinion it felt very similar to RaceRoom Racing Experience in that focusing on your fundamentals – much like Women’s basketball – was the key to clean, consistent laps. But as you pushed for that extra tenth or two out of each corner, the grip/slip/re-grip behavior exhibited by the outside rear tire demanded a level of throttle control and subtle steering inputs that only skilled sim racers posses. There was no longer an invisible hand of God keeping the car pointed in the proper direction, even with worn tires and a heavy right foot. Assetto Corsa, the Assetto Corsa that a lot of us fell in love with many years ago, has been resurrected from the grave.

244210_20161224170642_1So I urged Ethan to jump in a relatively empty pickup server at Silverstone, and turn some laps under racing conditions with the exact same setup which once frustrated him, just to confirm that hotfix released earlier this morning indeed rectified something within the tire model since the article shitting on it went live a few nights ago. The quote I received was “night and day.” While the Assetto Corsa fanboys immediately took to our comments section and blamed Ethan’s frustrations with the car on failing to use the proper traction control setting or incorrectly adjusting the setup to compensate for the new tire behavior – mistakes a driver as competent as Ethan wouldn’t make under any circumstances – behind the scenes, it appears Kunos did make some sort of error with the tire update deep within the game’s code. The exact same setup for the Mercedes AMG GT3 went from being atrocious on Tuesday evening, to bloody brilliant after a simple hotfix found its way into our Steam update queue.

This is the absolute best Assetto Corsa has felt in years.

244210_20161224172126_1In past articles discussing Assetto Corsa, both myself and our boy Sev have commented that there are certain turns in the default roster of tracks where you could just crank the wheel, plant the throttle, and the car would effortlessly navigate through the corner. One of these corners is Luffield at Silverstone International Raceway – a giant hairpin that should in theory require a lot of patience and delicate throttle control to prevent from melting off the left rear tire. Prior versions of Assetto Corsa have allowed you to lazily navigate this corner with little regard to any sort of skilled pedal inputs, and this was basically our ultimate test when it came to finding out what Kunos had done to the tire model after each update. Version 1.11.3 finally forces us to roll on the throttle and carefully manage the state of the left rear – a welcome change of pace from the hand of God keeping us perfectly balanced and letting us mat the throttle far before we could see the AstroTurf at the exit of the corner.

luffield

My stance on Assetto Corsa as a complete package won’t change, because quite frankly there are other simulators out there with a higher level of customization and functionality built into the vanilla package than what Kunos Simulazioni offer with Assetto Corsa. However, a major complaint I’ve had with this game is the team’s endless pursuit of tire model perfection, especially after getting it right so long ago, and then pointlessly wandering off in another direction for multiple years. With the 1.11.3 hotfix, I feel Kunos have finally achieved what made the GT3 entries feel so special when we first started becoming obsessed with the game, and on top of that, the numbers used in the garage screen directly correlate with what real life GT3 teams are running.

I’m extremely happy with the driving experience conveyed by Assetto Corsa Version 1.11.3, but I’m also very concerned. If the next major Assetto Corsa update brings with it Tire Model Version 11, and the handling characteristics of popular cars change all over again, it’s a surefire sign that modern racing simulator developers are taking shots in the dark and relying on the praise of overzealous fanboys to shout louder than the critics.

This one gets our stamp of approval. Please, for the love of God, don’t change it. The numbers are correct, and the behavior is right in line with that old school Assetto Corsa feel. Put this tire model in a glass display case for all to see, lock it up, and flush the key down the toilet. It’s been a long time since Assetto Corsa has felt this good, and it would be a shame if it was only temporary.

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98 thoughts on “1.11.3 – The Best Christmas Present

  1. >2016
    >still not playing GP4 with its superior tire model that BTFO’s Asshiteo corsa

    Nice railway arcade game fam. Stefano needs a gas chamber

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  2. Except that the hotfix was for a bug that affected aero damage (cars were faster after getting damaged….oops) and that the AMG GT3 data.acd file hasn’t been changed since the 15th….placebo is a hell of a drug….

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    1. I tested the AMG at Ring GP with the exact same setup and track/ambient conditions. Everything was identical, car felt totally different. I don’t know what to tell ya.

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        1. It’s people like you who exhibit surprise when you find out that James, Ethan, and others can run 10+ racing laps in a row, with them all being within .3 of each other.

          They know what they’re doing.

          Liked by 1 person

      1. Seems like that claim is true, the AMG wasn’t updated in the 1.11.3 update, only the Porsche GT3-R was as far as GT3s goes. So, this leaves us with two possibilities, either Kunos changed something in the engine itself that would cause this change (All that’s documented is fixes to damaged aero and a driver model change) or it really is placebo. The sad part is you really can’t prove either as the information isn’t there to support either (Can’t really crack open the physics engine and know what you’re looking at nor can you get people to say they’re wrong.)

        Personally the GT3-R feels like it has more grip on exit, the others feel mostly the same.

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      2. Did the same thing – AMG GT3 @ Nurb GP(GT) – as back to back as possible on 1.11.2 and 1.11.3 (basically about 24 hours apart, today’s I just used the most recent settings). Default setup both times cause I’m a bad (tires never got hotter than 75C) and there is, absolutely, a change in how the car drives.

        In .2 it had crazy crazy looseness. The schumacher S, a 4th gear uphill, it was not possible to go full throttle cause the car would oversteer. The exit of Mercedes, you could spin the car with full TC on. Heck I spun it coming out of the pits with full TC because I didn’t expect a GT3 to have so little rear lateral grip.

        In .3 this is entirely gone. Full throttle anywhere you want, the car is not going to spin unless you flick the tail out, TC can cut you off at slow speeds and at high speeds it’s not even a thing.

        Liked by 1 person

          1. I haven’t noticed any handling changes in the GT3 cars. I don’t want to imply that I think you guys are lying or something though; is it possible Ethan’s installation was fucked or something?

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            1. Honestly the way some people talk about AC’s handling jibes so little with my own experiences that it almost has to be something physics related getting desynced in the update process. For example I pretty regularly see “throttle/brake mid corner doesn’t do anything at all” which like… I have a DFGT, probably the weakest 900 degree FFB wheel on the market, and I can feel the effects of weight transfer during a corner as clear as day. If I brake the front grips up, if I throttle the front understeers (or if I really throttle, the rear starts to slide out).

              Could just be something like stability control getting reset, could be something more fundamental to the physics… all I know is my own game is set to pro assists and I’ve taken the time to linearize my ffb (custom lookup table from wheelcheck that eliminates the deadzone and so on) and touched very little else.

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          2. Have you actually compared 1.11. with 1.11.3 yourself? Or you just play broken phone game? Someone said that, so I say that…
            I have lapped SLS and AMG GT3 in 1.11.1 and it felt beautiful, without weird slidingreported in previous topix ( i havent experienced such good driving experience in AC for more than a year). I dont believe 1.11.3 changed anything regarding that.
            When i drove 1.11.1 it felt like that https://youtu.be/sOA8jJrqb1g
            Responsive and strong front with small adjusments to keep the rear rotating.

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      3. Maybe something in the sense of
        “sorry, I’m dumb, I’m a child and I fucked up, but my ego liked it so much to be a star on the internet, and I’m so glad I can hide behind my computer, and Ethan is not my real name…”

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    2. We both know Ethan’s a wheelman and is good enough to pick up subtle changes between builds. If he’s going from skating around on Tuesday, to loving the build on Saturday, with the exact same car setup & conditions, something had to have changed.

      Either that, or there’s a glitch similar to NASCAR 2011 on the X360 where the game randomly rapes your tires as soon as you spawn.

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    3. Given James’ skills, I doubt it’s a placebo.

      Perhaps aero issues were responsible for the earlier problems (I don’t recall any comments about the less aero dependent cars)?

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    1. >People messaging me that the tire heating is fucked
      >theres apparently talk about it on RaceDepartment
      >an actually competent sim racer documents on video one of the high downforce gt3 sports cars sliding around like its iracing
      >three days and a few hotfixes later
      >suddenly none of this exists anymore and it’s completely different to drive with the same exact setup & track conditions
      >AC shills shout placebo

      lel, never change.

      Liked by 2 people

        1. You ac shills are insufferable. We have video of the guy skating around on tires that have been brought to proper operating temperature. The cars no longer do that anymore.

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          1. I tested and they can still get loose in corners. I don’t know what or if something changed in tyres but 1.11.3 contains aerodynamic updates after report in the physics subforum.

            Also, you’re having an obession with fanboys/shills. Every breathing thing that doesn’t circlejerk around PRC’s idea of game/physics is a fanboy or shill.

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          2. It’s funny that you call me AC shill considering that you’ve used portions of complaints that I made in the past in order to write articles about AC flaws.

            I don’t need to see a video of some guy/girl provoking slides and doing nothing to stop them, when I have other tools to know that nothing changed. There are better ways to avoid placebo, like telemetry.

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          3. No doubt about it, Assetto Corsa shills are insufferable. What’s even more detestable are writers who constantly hate on the most popular sim because it will get them page views. Is AC perfect? Fuck no. Name one sim that is. There are going to be bumps along the way when you’re trying to code a consumer level video game to behave exactly like the real world.

            Automobilista, rFactor 2, Project Cars, IRacing & Assetto Corsa all do some things exceptionally well. Yet, not a one is perfect. How many times have you cried, like a little cunt, because Kunos has changed the tire model? You wanted it left untouched from 2 years ago, right? How much crying were you doing when camber was fucked, when heating was fucked, etc? So, you wanted all that fixed, but you wanted the tire to stay exactly the same.

            You guys have a very successful blog because people are too weak to say Fuck PRC. They are a cancer and perpetuate everything that is wrong with the sim racing community. My first visit in ~10 months only because a friend told me how funny the article is due to your placebo improvement with the tires version 10. I didn’t believe him and now I owe him a case of beer.

            Liked by 1 person

  3. the best Christmas present was taken down after stefano had another heart attack and a mini lashing out at a quality modder making the mercedes c9 better than they did.

    it will take very little quality work from studio 397 from reasonable modders to abandon stefano and make quality work for a platform where developers appreciate and don’t say absurd crap.

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    1. Hear hear, now this is something much more interesting that some weird tires issues.

      Care to elaborate on that, or post some links of where all of this happened?

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      1. Someone took the Kunos Mercedes Benz C9 and modified it to be representative of the “Sprint Model” whereas the C9 in Assetto Corsa is actually the LeMans version. So, a bunch of stuff is different between the Sprint & LM versions. But now, thanks to the handiwork of some modder, we were able to have both versions in the game.

        The modder who released this on Race Department wrote in his description that this little project of his had the full backing and support of Kunos. If I remember correctly I think he may even have said Kunos gave him assistance in this project. The problem was those were lies. Kunos never gave permission to use their model, modify their physics and then announce it was supported by Kunos!

        So, being one of the owners of Kunos, Stefano asked Race Department to take it down. They did, just like they should. It’s about respecting other people’s property and furthermore this modder might have even gotten away with it if he didn’t go around lying and saying that he had not only permission from Kunos, but also assistance from Kunos in making this variation.

        You do realize that Kunos could probably be sued by Mercedes-Benz if they were helping create cars that they don’t have a license to. I hope you do understand that. Kunos can’t rip off the wing, lower the power and say “TADA! Lamborghini Aventador. Download for free at Race Department dot com!”

        I’m sure half of the people reading this are sitting there with a smirk on their face thinking: Oh yeah. Like Mercedes fucking cares…(eye roll). Except companies do care. Why the motherfucking fuck do you think there were no Porsche’s in PC sims for 15 years?!

        Also, most people who use mods and those who make mods pretty much agree that if you’re going to convert a track or a car from another sim, you should get permission from the person who made the original track. How many times have we read something along the lines of “Oh well. Targa Florio project for AC is dead. The original modders who made the LFS track that was going to be converted didn’t give permission.”?? How many times do we see text files with our mods saying – please do not use any materials or objects without first checking with me, please. Does PRC call those people fucking assholes or babies for doing that?

        So, I’m supposed to give some dude halfway around the world who builds semi-decent tracks the respect of not using his content when I want to convert his 9 year old LFS track to AC, but I can shit all over Kunos, right? And I’m sure 90% of people who actually took the time to read this are still saying to themselves, What’s the big fucking deal? Get over yourself AC fanboy. Fuck Kunos. I’ll do what I want. But then next week they’ll be respectful if Lilski contacts them and asks that they don’t use his track for modification purposes.

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    1. Oh yes there is a reason. They thought they were so clever and found a physics issue which was so critical devs had to patch it on xmas eve. It’s a shame no files were touched and it was completely placebo. But it certainly was a great story.

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  4. The title of this article is clearly a dig at rF2 and as a result I have been triggered!

    After reading this article I gave AC yet another shot. Admittedly it feels great, and probably feels the most like a real car out of all the sims (car moves around a lot on it’s suspension down straights etc etc.) But I always reach the same sticking point which makes me close AC and click on rF2. Braking in AC just doesn’t seem to rotate the car, tuck in the front and tighten the line. I see this as the biggest difference between AC and rF2.

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    1. That is exactly the thing that makes AC a major letdown for me as well. That and the FFB that doesn’t do a lot in the terms of providing any useful info about stuff happening in the front. Still, the best AC version so far. The GT500, however, is more of a Christmas present, to be honest.

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  5. Believe it or not, I can side with James in terms of how can it be a placebo effect for him, if he had to re-install & shit after not playing for who knows how long?

    His buddy on the other hand, dug himself into a hole by comparing real apples to virtual oranges (I can re-use phrases too!!!) from which there was no logical recovery.

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    1. So rather than the matter at hand, you want to discuss something that happened in the comments section two days ago. Okay.

      I didn’t care to dignify your needlessly condescending comment with a response. This does not mean you dumbfounded me into submission and valiantly destroyed my case with logic, it means I stopped giving a fuck because there’s far more to my life than sitting around arguing about computer games. Discussing? I’m down. Arguing? Nah.

      They fixed it anyway, so the whole thing’s moot.

      Move on. Merry Christmas to you.

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      1. -Bring up the fact that 2 different cars, even when abiding by the same regs, simply will not be the same.
        -And if we’re going to start comparing shit, we need to get the right data to do so properly, even if it’s just videogames.
        -“Straw-grasping”

        I was totally down for ‘discussing’ why you thought 2 different GT3 entries could be treated the same, why you thought 1 onboard of 1 driver could be applied to all else, fuck the amount of variables present in such an assumption, etc.
        (Admittedly it would’ve been hell to do that in the comments of PRC, vs. a forum or something, but whatever.)

        But if you just blow-off a valid point like that without anything concrete to back it up, of course I’m going to find offensive and go-on like I did.

        Happy Holidays, maybe your install was fucked, maybe not, ’tis the story of modern PC gaming, 2016.

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        1. I acknowledge the difference between the cars, but that said they are both front-engine and rear-wheel-drive so I didn’t think the difference would be that huge. It wasn’t even my intention to compare the cars; I only really linked the M6 as an example of how I felt a GT3 car should behave, and the fact that it had a throttle input display sold me. As for me using an AMG in AC, all GT3s in AC exhibited this issue and the AMG just so happened to be the car I was driving at the time. The clip really was just a quick 4am “lookadis” to James over Teamspeak, I never really intended it to be used as the centrepiece of a PRC article.

          For the straw-grasping thing, you are correct that we need certain facets of data to make a legitimate comparison, but like I said it wasn’t my intent to compare the cars at all. Again, I linked the M6 example just to show how I felt GT3s in general should cope with corner exit (I mean, it’s pretty much how AC’s did so before Kunos decided to literally reinvent the wheel for a tenth time).

          This would have been my original response, but your opening sentence in your comment (about M6 β‰  AMG) came off as bloody condescending, so that’s why I responded the way I did.

          I don’t think my install was fucked, James was having the same issue as I did and felt the same difference I did after the hotfix today. There was also an anon in here who apparently felt the same thing. But hey, regardless of how, what, why or when, in our minds it’s now fixed (until Kunos decide to spuff it up again with another tire model revision) so all is well. Whole deal’s moot, as far as I’m concerned anyway. Hell, if some feel no difference when they liked how things were at the time of the first article, I guess everybody’s happy…!

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          1. Now this is how I was hoping discussion would’ve gone initially.

            Yes, both are FR-drivetrain cars, but from a technical stand-point, please consider things like CoG, how the weight distribution is affected by where the engine/trans/diff is located vertically and horizontally – i.e. the ‘measurements’of each individual car’s components, rather than the general ‘location’ of front/mid/rear, how that affects suspensions/tires, not to mention the aero package on top of it all for each car, followed by any/all BoP adjustments, namely weight.

            One ‘problem’ I’m noticing is that older games and some more recent mods ‘lump’ cars under the same set of physics, making a Camaro GT3 drive like a GTR-GT3, which leads to the assumptions we/I were making beforehand. (You using the M6 as an example, and me thinking otherwise, ‘internet miscommunication’ I guess you could call it.)

            It wasn’t my intention to be condescending, and I’m not trying to be here either, I just spend way too much time analyzing shit about real racecars and tend to get a bit passionate about things I like as such. I simply saw 2 points of data that should have absolutely no correlation to each other being presented from 1 side.
            Perhaps I jumped the gun and made the wrong initial interpretation and things went on from there. I’m not fast enough to close-in on that last 3% and notice oddities like you or James (believe me I wish I was), so for 97% of the time things felt fine for me, therefore I didn’t think an issue could be present or debated outside of Alien territory.

            But as you say, fixed is fixed. I’m going to get some sleep now as this late-night shit is not my thing, unless there’s an enduro on, which isn’t for a few months yet I believe.

            tl;dr – I guess you could say I got ‘triggered’ or whatever.

            Liked by 1 person

          2. I doubt it was an intentional change, the aero fix could easily have been causing all kinds of physics fuckups – when you have code not working as intended, the results will generally come up in unexpected places through the whole system. No point speculating without a running copy of the game that’s broken, but since it was aero-damage related, maybe people who had damage turned off were completely getting different handling.

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  6. I think all the v10 cars (at least the ones I’ve tried) feel pretty good. I hope they get the rest of the cars updated soon, because some of them (M3 E30 Gra/DTM I’m looking at you) are terrible on the v7 tires.

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  7. This is pretty hilarious. After reading your previous article concerning 1.11, James, I ended up with a conclusion that you were simply being ridiculous… especially because you kept insisting the TM of 4.0 was, like, the best thing that ever graced simulators in a whole (and my opinion is that anything before the 1.0 was utter crap, even though 1.0 wasn’t faring all that much better either).

    However, a curiosity fit took over the voices of reason, forcing me to reinstall this “simulator”. As expected, it felt totally different to what you had explained in that article. I had a laugh, wanted to tell you the article was a bunch of BS, but it so happened that I forgot about that intention… Now, one little detail… The version I tested was the 1.11.3 you just described here πŸ™‚

    After some time had passed I remembered of what I was going to do, checked PRC… and here’s this article πŸ™‚ And I’m pretty much agree with you on all except those regarding the 4.x versions points. The current version is the best AC so far. Still, the braking is as shitty as ever. At least now it has a reason to reside on my HDD.

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  8. So, Maybe I’m talking out my ass, but could it be that the aero/downforce modifications could change the grip produced by the tires?

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  9. Congratulations Kunos!
    You have finally done one thing right. The Tyre Model. And that is, of course, a significant achievement.

    Here’s the to do list for 2017:
    – FFB that makes sense and actually tells you what’s going on;
    – zero stability augmentation setting that actually disables the stab;
    – now for the hardest part: some proper dynamics/inertia/suspension modeling (this one might indeed take you all the way into 2020). As it is now, your “sim” behaves like a GT clone, albeit on the right tyres, which is a shame.

    Thanks for taking your time reading this. Merry Christmas!

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        1. Thermo-mechanical Tire Models
          In the last decade, new formulations for tire control force generation have been introduced. Sometimes called simply β€œthermal models” these tire performance formulations are more than just tire temperature predictors – These models are typically derived from first principals, and are aimed at calculating tire forces (which are indeed related to temperature) based on the excitation content in the tire contact patch.Β  This approach necessitates detailed mapping of the road surfaces on which the vehicle is driven, which, if the fidelity is appropriate, can sometimes be derived from the same LiDAR scanning data sets that produce information for DIL graphics. Although this modelling approach originated in top-level motorsports, it is now making its way into road car DIL simulation programs since it is useful for vehicle simulations of events such as transient handling/maneuvering and limit performance.

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  10. Steam:

    Rfactor 2 : Mostly Positive – 70% of the 20 user reviews in the last 30 days are positive.

    Assetto Corsa: Very Positive – 90% of the 527 user reviews in the last 30 days are positive

    Merry Christmas Assiciat0r πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚πŸ˜‚

    Liked by 1 person

        1. So, if they were on Steam, then we would certainly have a new sim king(s) πŸ™‚

          Not even sure if Associator is still reading this blog, by the way. At least I haven’t seen that pattern around for a while. I guess for a Kunos fanboi everyone mentioning rF2 in a good light is him πŸ™‚ That’s pretty much in compliance with your herd logic that numbers speak for themselves though πŸ™‚

          Except that guy uses a keyboard while racing in rF2. While for this sim a wheel is an absolute must. AC, on the other hand, doesn’t need a wheel. It’s heavily optimized for the “alternative means”. In fact, its FFB is an utter crap and there is a stability helper that you can’t really switch off, so… Enjoy your GT for MS Windows πŸ™‚ With a good enough tire model, at least…

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            1. You are welcome. Was happy to help. Merry Christmas to you too.
              I will proceed with reclaiming my 30 gigs of disk space in the meantime…

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          1. Stop spreading major disinformation.

            rFactor 2 has assists and sensitivity settings to make it even playable with just a keyboard, meanwhile keyboard experience in Assetto Corsa is unsatisfactory, because its speed sensitive steering is not adjustable so the steering will be jerky and not smooth. It also lacks a steering assist that takes the track contour into account, so in fast large bends and on straights you end up loosing steering response, which makes it too difficult to consistently correct the car or drive alongside opponents. It also doesn’t allow manual clutch, nor override Traction Control while driving with keyboard.

            Have a majorly nice Christmas.

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            1. Why don’t you make yourself a nice Christmas present and go freaking buy a wheel already? Believe me, it’s totally worth it. Except not with AC, but oh, well… Maybe at some point in 2020.

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              1. There is a big misconception in the simracing community that you can’t play hardcore sims with keyboard. Keyboard is the primary PC input device since the beginning of time, there is nothing wrong with using it, but I don’t drive AC with a keyboard since it doesn’t have proper support for it like ISI based simulators.

                I want first class keyboard support, like being able to manual clutch, speed sensitivity adjusments and steering assist like in rFactor, rFactor2 and Automobilista, these are currenlty the only harcdore sim that can properly be played with just a keyboard.

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                1. Ah, there you are, Associat0r, buddy πŸ™‚ I thought you had left these forums for good.

                  Yes, you can play hardcore simulators with a keyboard. You can also theoretically attend your own teeth while using a mirror or something… It all depends on how cheap and how much of a masochist you are.

                  I didn’t start with a wheel myself, but I’m never going back, thank you very much. There is a little appeal in the process of driving if you can’t feel the forces. Especially during the braking. And that’s exactly why I got rid of AC for good for the umpteenth time already. It’s nice to train your muscle memory from time to time, but it gets old really fast. If I can’t feel the reaction from the front wheels all the time and am rather forced to check my braking efficiency based on the rate of the trajectory tightening and whether or not I can hear the wheels becoming progressively square of not, the thing can have all the tire models in the world, I don’t need it. It simply is not worth driving like that. And you suggest using a keyboard… That’s not even funny.

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  11. Looks like you guys were right. I really hope they stop fucking around with the tire model. I’ve already backed up this release and I’ll get a torrent copy as well, if the privateers bother with a seemingly minor version change (unlikely).

    BTW, I finally got a copy of pre-release 0.4 off TPB. Didn’t even have a virus πŸ˜‰

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  12. The Game always had some flaws, but not to this extent that one could say life changed from improvements coming from one update to another, iΒ΄ve always kept my eye on your findings about the game and did not always agree, as the articles often had a ranting caracter and i was seldomly able to reenact the problems you found. But i gotta say….come on dude the game was always good fun as far as i can remember (since Dreampack one) and the handling and FFB always resembled GTR2 which in my opinion was the simulator to go with, fun and handling wise. But i cant just see all this improvement youΒ΄re making up here, the caracteristics of the cars remained always very similar, only slight changes, maybe in the tyre behaviour sure but the cars very much remained the same since they were released so i dunno where you discovered this new world as AC really was always this good. But i say dont cheer up to soon as the next update may bring up some shady problems youΒ΄ll find in some steam comments, so enjoy it while it lasts (whatever that state is or means)

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      1. And I just did an experiment with exactly the same combo you were talking about and I can be 100% sure that there is absolutely no difference between 11.2 and 11.3. I have replays and uncut onboards which I can ofcourse edit into split screen video but because the similarity is so obvious, I can’t see a reason to do that.

        As someone said, “Placebo is a hell of a drug”.

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          1. I’m the wrong guy answering to this question. That you should ask from people having problems. All I know is that there shouldn’t be any difference between the two.

            Like

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